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Post by sy » August 5, 2005 11:10 am

While he goes through and says how the media is biased toward white people and that minorities are not considered as newsworthy, he stereotypes the girl generally as a slut and that she quite possibly could have created her own fate.

If you're trying to chastize the media for being biased, then you shouldn't turn around and stereotype anyone.
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Post by LaTda » August 5, 2005 11:11 am

iuparrothead wrote:
LaTda wrote:you can just about tell by the replies who has a daughter & who doesn't
I don't have a daughter. :-?
I qualified it with "just about" cause I knew someone would retort with that :lol:
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Post by sy » August 5, 2005 11:11 am

AlbatrossFlyer wrote:white & middle-class = 24/7 media coverage

black & poor = who?
and heavens forbid if you're a celebrity and get a hangnail. We'll hear about it for years.
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Post by PHBeerman » August 5, 2005 11:14 am

7lords wrote:I'm 100% with you on this point. His implications about Natalee are 100% out of line. And I have no problem with what her family has done - I would think less of them if they didn't do everything they could.
He is correct however. Why do high-school kids choose Aruba?


Same reason I used to go to Canada. To party. I wish the family/media would not try to deny this fact.

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Post by iuparrothead » August 5, 2005 11:14 am

LaTda wrote:
iuparrothead wrote:
LaTda wrote:you can just about tell by the replies who has a daughter & who doesn't
I don't have a daughter. :-?
I qualified it with "just about" cause I knew someone would retort with that :lol:
:P
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Post by iuparrothead » August 5, 2005 11:15 am

sy wrote:While he goes through and says how the media is biased toward white people and that minorities are not considered as newsworthy, he stereotypes the girl generally as a slut and that she quite possibly could have created her own fate.

If you're trying to chastize the media for being biased, then you shouldn't turn around and stereotype anyone.
Right on!!!
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Post by buffettbride » August 5, 2005 11:15 am

PHBeerman wrote:
7lords wrote:I'm 100% with you on this point. His implications about Natalee are 100% out of line. And I have no problem with what her family has done - I would think less of them if they didn't do everything they could.
He is correct however. Why do high-school kids choose Aruba?


Same reason I used to go to Canada. To party. I wish the family/media would not try to deny this fact.
It's why they go to Mexico as well. Maybe the US should clue in that the "21" law is kinda assinine and worthless and teach kids to be socially responsible. That's a whole other issue though, but it is my opinion.
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Post by PHBeerman » August 5, 2005 11:16 am

LaTda wrote:you can just about tell by the replies who has a daughter & who doesn't
I have 2 young sons. Based on Genetics they will probably each be over 6'3"

Will I send them off to party when they graduate and then act like they are going for innocent purposes? Hell NO.

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Post by LaTda » August 5, 2005 11:20 am

PHBeerman wrote:
LaTda wrote:you can just about tell by the replies who has a daughter & who doesn't
I have 2 young sons. Based on Genetics they will probably each be over 6'3"

Will I send them off to party when they graduate and then act like they are going for innocent purposes? Hell NO.
^ thank you for solidifying my theory
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Post by sy » August 5, 2005 11:23 am

PHBeerman wrote: Will I send them off to party when they graduate and then act like they are going for innocent purposes? Hell NO.
I remember in high school our class trip was to Disneyworld. 320+ kids with 20 chaperones. My mom and dad didn't even let me get the question out of my mouth. The answer was 'no, and there will be no discussion about it'. In retrospect, it was a damned good answer.

My husband went with his class (forget where they went) and he said it was a wonder no one died with the amount of alcohol, drugs, and sex that went on. It was just a free for all. All the chaperones did their own thing.

Not sure what the point is of class trips like that.
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Post by PHBeerman » August 5, 2005 11:25 am

sy wrote:
PHBeerman wrote: Will I send them off to party when they graduate and then act like they are going for innocent purposes? Hell NO.
I remember in high school our class trip was to Disneyworld. 320+ kids with 20 chaperones. My mom and dad didn't even let me get the question out of my mouth. The answer was 'no, and there will be no discussion about it'. In retrospect, it was a damned good answer.

My husband went with his class (forget where they went) and he said it was a wonder no one died with the amount of alcohol, drugs, and sex that went on. It was just a free for all. All the chaperones did their own thing.

Not sure what the point is of class trips like that.
Exactly. These parents should not be acting like they are in the running for parent of the year. They made a stupid decision to let their kid go to a foreign country and party like an adult.

Like I said in my first post tragic situation. Spot on opinion.

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Post by iuparrothead » August 5, 2005 11:29 am

sy wrote:
PHBeerman wrote: Will I send them off to party when they graduate and then act like they are going for innocent purposes? Hell NO.
I remember in high school our class trip was to Disneyworld. 320+ kids with 20 chaperones. My mom and dad didn't even let me get the question out of my mouth. The answer was 'no, and there will be no discussion about it'. In retrospect, it was a damned good answer.

My husband went with his class (forget where they went) and he said it was a wonder no one died with the amount of alcohol, drugs, and sex that went on. It was just a free for all. All the chaperones did their own thing.

Not sure what the point is of class trips like that.
No kidding! Even if Natalee went off with that Joran kid and they shagged like rabbits, it does not disqualify her from being considered a 'good girl'. She was very smart, full ride scholarship to the University of Alabama, was going to be pre-med.

She's young and horny just like the boys are... it doesn't mean she asked to be murdered. Such a double standard for girls! :roll: :-?
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Post by ParrotheadGator » August 5, 2005 11:39 am

iuparrothead wrote:
PHBeerman wrote:It is a tragic situation. But this dude is spot on.
About many points but 2 glaring misconceptions.

1) She's an 18 year old girl/woman, that made a bad decision fueled by hormones & alcohol... that, by no means, makes her a 'slut'.

2) The clothing she wore is irrelevant and also, by no means, makes her a 'slut'.
so hormones are an excuse for stupidity? Funny...If I had gotten a girl pregnant when I was younger, my parents wouldn't have blamed it on hormones. They would have blamed it on stupidity and irresponsibility.

Anyway, the writer doesn't directly call her a slut...just said she was dressed like a slut and went off with people she didn't know....apparently her own friends pointed this out. I think the guy is dead on....girls don't go with their girlfriends down to a place like Aruba when they're innocent....just look at a Girls Gone Wild tape :lol: :lol: They go down there to get drunk and act like whores, then come home and pretend it never happened. She certainly didn't deserve to be killed (assuming she was, she is most likely)....but she's certainly partly responsible for what happened.

You can make excuses for her and blame hormones and liquor, but what she did was flat out stupid and irresponsible and has only herself to blame. It's not like she was forced into the car with strangers.

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Post by PHBeerman » August 5, 2005 11:42 am

iuparrothead wrote: No kidding! Even if Natalee went off with that Joran kid and they shagged like rabbits, it does not disqualify her from being considered a 'good girl'. She was very smart, full ride scholarship to the University of Alabama, was going to be pre-med.

She's young and horny just like the boys are... it doesn't mean she asked to be murdered. Such a double standard for girls! :roll: :-?
I guess my point is I would not claim that my boys were innocent nor try to pass them off as angels if these same circumstances were present.

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Post by ParrotheadGator » August 5, 2005 11:43 am

To answer the double standard part...you're damn right there's a double stand. Not because it's ok for guys to be whores and girls can't be...that's really irrelevant. It's because guys can take care of themselves. They don't have to worry about what a woman might do to them. With the types of crimes committed against women, they have to be more cautious and use more smarts. A lot of women try the independent, "I can't take care of myself" routine...but that's pure crap. When a man tries to kidnap them, rape them, whatever...they can't take care of themselve in 99% of cases. It's just a fact.

In my opinion, that's why double standards should exist...not because of the reputation of being a slut...but more for safety...that's realtiy.

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Post by PA PAR8 HED » August 5, 2005 11:49 am

That was very harsh.

Still, I find it interesting how the media will latch on to certain stories and ride them forever. So many people seem to go missing yet so few get any attention, let alone daily updates on every national newscast.

Why is the "run away bride" still news?
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Post by iuparrothead » August 5, 2005 11:52 am

ParrotheadGator wrote:
iuparrothead wrote:
PHBeerman wrote:It is a tragic situation. But this dude is spot on.
About many points but 2 glaring misconceptions.

1) She's an 18 year old girl/woman, that made a bad decision fueled by hormones & alcohol... that, by no means, makes her a 'slut'.

2) The clothing she wore is irrelevant and also, by no means, makes her a 'slut'.
so hormones are an excuse for stupidity? Funny...If I had gotten a girl pregnant when I was younger, my parents wouldn't have blamed it on hormones. They would have blamed it on stupidity and irresponsibility.

Anyway, the writer doesn't directly call her a slut...just said she was dressed like a slut and went off with people she didn't know....apparently her own friends pointed this out. I think the guy is dead on....girls don't go with their girlfriends down to a place like Aruba when they're innocent....just look at a Girls Gone Wild tape :lol: :lol: They go down there to get drunk and act like whores, then come home and pretend it never happened. She certainly didn't deserve to be killed (assuming she was, she is most likely)....but she's certainly partly responsible for what happened.

You can make excuses for her and blame hormones and liquor, but what she did was flat out stupid and irresponsible and has only herself to blame. It's not like she was forced into the car with strangers.
I never suggested hormones are an excuse for anything. But people are so quick to label this girl as a slut and a whore because she liked a boy and went off with him to do whatever they did. That's just being young and irresponsible... like most teenagers are. If you have sex with someone at 18 years old... even with a guy you've only known for a week... it doesn't make you a slut, dirty, shameful, etc.

And of course they went to Aruba to party... but wanting to drink and party at 18 years old does not equivocate being a whore. The girls gone wild reference is a weak example... that's not a good representation of the majority of 18 year old girls that would go on a school trip to Aruba. (College girls going to Cancun... now that's a different story)

In the end... the girl made a tragically poor decision. There very well may have been date rape drugs as well as alcohol involved. She's responsible for her poor decisions, but her decisions weren't because she is a slut... but rather because she's a typical teenager.
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Post by RinglingRingling » August 5, 2005 12:00 pm

UAHparrothead wrote:What if it was your daughter missing? If it was mine I would want it on the news 24/7 until she was found or some solid answers were discovered. This guy is ragging on the Holloway family and making them out to be bums on the streets of Aruba asking Please sir May I have some more? They are down there trying to find their daughter, who is probably dead or worse and these assclown is gonna rag them on it. I'll go along with the whole news media taking advantage of this situation to get ratings and I can't stand Nancy Grace, but ragging on the family isn't right.
If it were my daughter missing, yes, I'd be working trying to find her. I would not be second-guessing the police in a foreign country and trying to use American logic as the standard for what they should or should not be doing. I also would not be on the news day in and day out. Time spent in front of the cameras is time you could be looking. (and not sticking your foot in your mouth)

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Post by RinglingRingling » August 5, 2005 12:01 pm

buffettbride wrote:
RinglingRingling wrote:
I remember back to a story a few years ago: A little 6 year old beauty pagent contestant disappears. Media goes nuts.
That would be Jon Bonet Ramsey.
Yes dear. I know. Was just using the juxtapositioning of little blonde 6 year old beauty queen with a library of headshots vs. a little black girl in a stairwell.

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Post by AlbatrossFlyer » August 5, 2005 12:02 pm

PHBeerman wrote:
7lords wrote:I'm 100% with you on this point. His implications about Natalee are 100% out of line. And I have no problem with what her family has done - I would think less of them if they didn't do everything they could.
He is correct however. Why do high-school kids choose Aruba?


Same reason I used to go to Canada. To party. I wish the family/media would not try to deny this fact.
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