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Well said Cubbie...

I think there are way too many people here who assume it will never happen to them. I can tell you as well from experience that, whether through illness, accident or downsizing, it's remarkably easy to find yourself in need of some assistance.

Sure there are those who abuse the system - but as Cubbie says, there are those who abuse ANY system, white or blue collar.. But part of what makes this country so great is that we do our best to provide for ALL of our citizens to ensure that they all at least have an equal opportunity to pursue the Amercian dream.

Thanks, Lee for having some basic human compassion and being able to see beyond the obvious.

And I applaud your courage, Cubbie Bear. I could have told hundreds of similiar stories, but having it comes from someone I respect (and who is known on BN) makes it more poignant.

And Captain P, I agree with many of your points.

In my social work classes, I teach my students that most familes are 1 to 4 paychecks from poverty. How long could your family survive with the loss of the major or only income? The "experts" recommend that a family have 6 to 12 months income in savings for emergencies. I know that Capt Cougie & I do not have that much. Do you? My hubby has worked for the same company for almost 28 years and spent 2 months laid off last year. Yes, it can happed to anyone. And no, we didn't need food stamps, but our medical coverage was in jeopardy. Just before he went back to work, we got a bill for $700/ month for COBRA coverage, now that we could not pay.

Thanks Cubbie, for putting a "face" people know on this issue. The system exists because sometimes bad things happen to good people. It's not a perfect system, but it's better than nothing at all.

SuperTrooper wrote:Thanks Cubbie, for putting a "face" people know on this issue. The system exists because sometimes bad things happen to good people. It's not a perfect system, but it's better than nothing at all.

Amen to everything you said, Super Trooper

son of a beach wrote:but race was indeed brought up

the "large black family" with food stamps (if they were white would that have been mentioned)
If I were black on here this would offend me, but being that that I'm white and my wife is black it is offensive anyway.

"Puerto Ricans just take our welfare"
The comment about "Idiots who vote for whoever Al Sharton, Farakahn, and Jesse Jackson", mostly black and everyone knows this.
I mean come on just say it , ya know you want to.

Some people should realize that some of the people or races they are talking about could be on here and how could these comments not be offensive when you're stereotyping or profiling?
From my unique perspective and experiences I've seen it a million times and am pretty good at reading between the lines.

SO YOU'D PREFER I MAKE SURE THERE ARE NO MINORITIES ACTUALLY ON HERE BEFORE I MAKE MY COMMENTS?I DONT REALLY CARE WHO IS HERE,MY OPINIONS ARE BASED ON WHAT I SEE ON A DAILY BASIS AND I WILL NOT REFRAIN FROM COMMENTING ON IT TO BE SURE I DONT OFFEND ANYONE.
AND WHAT DO YOU MEAN JUST SAY IT BECAUSE I WANT TO?WHAT IS IT YOU THINK I WANT TO SAY THAT I HAVENT?

son of a beach wrote:but race was indeed brought up

the "large black family" with food stamps (if they were white would that have been mentioned)
If I were black on here this would offend me, but being that that I'm white and my wife is black it is offensive anyway.

"Puerto Ricans just take our welfare"
The comment about "Idiots who vote for whoever Al Sharton, Farakahn, and Jesse Jackson", mostly black and everyone knows this.
I mean come on just say it , ya know you want to.

Some people should realize that some of the people or races they are talking about could be on here and how could these comments not be offensive when you're stereotyping or profiling?
From my unique perspective and experiences I've seen it a million times and am pretty good at reading between the lines.

If it was, I apologize. But my point is that when the KKK was brought up, the debate was between 2 white people, one of whom was arguing that she used to be in this situation, and worked her way out. The Klan was brought up at a point in the debate that had nothing to do with race.

big hat carmen wrote:Thanks, Lee for having some basic human compassion and being able to see beyond the obvious.

And I applaud your courage, Cubbie Bear. I could have told hundreds of similiar stories, but having it comes from someone I respect (and who is known on BN) makes it more poignant.

And Captain P, I agree with many of your points.

In my social work classes, I teach my students that most familes are 1 to 4 paychecks from poverty. How long could your family survive with the loss of the major or only income? The "experts" recommend that a family have 6 to 12 months income in savings for emergencies. I know that Capt Cougie & I do not have that much. Do you? My hubby has worked for the same company for almost 28 years and spent 2 months laid off last year. Yes, it can happed to anyone. And no, we didn't need food stamps, but our medical coverage was in jeopardy. Just before he went back to work, we got a bill for $700/ month for COBRA coverage, now that we could not pay.

yep... a former friend of mine lost her job a year ago in Feb. Her COBRA payments were about half of her UI check per month. to make a long story short, never try to explain finance and taxes to someone in denial... But, having been out of work a couple times for about a year total in the last 10 years, it gets pretty scary, and part of that time was spent without health insurance either.

RinglingRingling wrote:

big hat carmen wrote:Thanks, Lee for having some basic human compassion and being able to see beyond the obvious.

And I applaud your courage, Cubbie Bear. I could have told hundreds of similiar stories, but having it comes from someone I respect (and who is known on BN) makes it more poignant.

And Captain P, I agree with many of your points.

In my social work classes, I teach my students that most familes are 1 to 4 paychecks from poverty. How long could your family survive with the loss of the major or only income? The "experts" recommend that a family have 6 to 12 months income in savings for emergencies. I know that Capt Cougie & I do not have that much. Do you? My hubby has worked for the same company for almost 28 years and spent 2 months laid off last year. Yes, it can happed to anyone. And no, we didn't need food stamps, but our medical coverage was in jeopardy. Just before he went back to work, we got a bill for $700/ month for COBRA coverage, now that we could not pay.

yep... a former friend of mine lost her job a year ago in Feb. Her COBRA payments were about half of her UI check per month. to make a long story short, never try to explain finance and taxes to someone in denial... But, having been out of work a couple times for about a year total in the last 10 years, it gets pretty scary, and part of that time was spent without health insurance either.

YOU'D HAVE FREE HEALTH CARE IF YOU WERE A CRIMINAL IN JAIL OR ON WELFARE THOUGH

CaptainP wrote:

If it was, I apologize. But my point is that when the KKK was brought up, the debate was between 2 white people, one of whom was arguing that she used to be in this situation, and worked her way out. The Klan was brought up at a point in the debate that had nothing to do with race.

Captain... you have to understand that the "late for the Klan meeting" is a phrase that a few folks have used as a joke in other threads. I believe it was meant in the same vein, not as an actual accusation.

Regardless, I think we could all move on from that.

tommcat327 wrote:

RinglingRingling wrote:

big hat carmen wrote:Thanks, Lee for having some basic human compassion and being able to see beyond the obvious.

And I applaud your courage, Cubbie Bear. I could have told hundreds of similiar stories, but having it comes from someone I respect (and who is known on BN) makes it more poignant.

And Captain P, I agree with many of your points.

In my social work classes, I teach my students that most familes are 1 to 4 paychecks from poverty. How long could your family survive with the loss of the major or only income? The "experts" recommend that a family have 6 to 12 months income in savings for emergencies. I know that Capt Cougie & I do not have that much. Do you? My hubby has worked for the same company for almost 28 years and spent 2 months laid off last year. Yes, it can happed to anyone. And no, we didn't need food stamps, but our medical coverage was in jeopardy. Just before he went back to work, we got a bill for $700/ month for COBRA coverage, now that we could not pay.

yep... a former friend of mine lost her job a year ago in Feb. Her COBRA payments were about half of her UI check per month. to make a long story short, never try to explain finance and taxes to someone in denial... But, having been out of work a couple times for about a year total in the last 10 years, it gets pretty scary, and part of that time was spent without health insurance either.

YOU'D HAVE FREE HEALTH CARE IF YOU WERE A CRIMINAL IN JAIL OR ON WELFARE THOUGH

yeah.. I can see free plastic surgery, quintuple bypasses and transplants among so many of our jail populations...

You really think that the quality of care, and the priority you receive in prison is incredibly-high?

RinglingRingling wrote:

tommcat327 wrote:

RinglingRingling wrote:

big hat carmen wrote:Thanks, Lee for having some basic human compassion and being able to see beyond the obvious.

And I applaud your courage, Cubbie Bear. I could have told hundreds of similiar stories, but having it comes from someone I respect (and who is known on BN) makes it more poignant.

And Captain P, I agree with many of your points.

In my social work classes, I teach my students that most familes are 1 to 4 paychecks from poverty. How long could your family survive with the loss of the major or only income? The "experts" recommend that a family have 6 to 12 months income in savings for emergencies. I know that Capt Cougie & I do not have that much. Do you? My hubby has worked for the same company for almost 28 years and spent 2 months laid off last year. Yes, it can happed to anyone. And no, we didn't need food stamps, but our medical coverage was in jeopardy. Just before he went back to work, we got a bill for $700/ month for COBRA coverage, now that we could not pay.

yep... a former friend of mine lost her job a year ago in Feb. Her COBRA payments were about half of her UI check per month. to make a long story short, never try to explain finance and taxes to someone in denial... But, having been out of work a couple times for about a year total in the last 10 years, it gets pretty scary, and part of that time was spent without health insurance either.

YOU'D HAVE FREE HEALTH CARE IF YOU WERE A CRIMINAL IN JAIL OR ON WELFARE THOUGH

yeah.. I can see free plastic surgery, quintuple bypasses and transplants among so many of our jail populations...

You really think that the quality of care, and the priority you receive in prison is incredibly-high?

Higher than they deserve I am sure!!

live2ski wrote:

RinglingRingling wrote:

tommcat327 wrote:

RinglingRingling wrote:

big hat carmen wrote:Thanks, Lee for having some basic human compassion and being able to see beyond the obvious.

And I applaud your courage, Cubbie Bear. I could have told hundreds of similiar stories, but having it comes from someone I respect (and who is known on BN) makes it more poignant.

And Captain P, I agree with many of your points.

In my social work classes, I teach my students that most familes are 1 to 4 paychecks from poverty. How long could your family survive with the loss of the major or only income? The "experts" recommend that a family have 6 to 12 months income in savings for emergencies. I know that Capt Cougie & I do not have that much. Do you? My hubby has worked for the same company for almost 28 years and spent 2 months laid off last year. Yes, it can happed to anyone. And no, we didn't need food stamps, but our medical coverage was in jeopardy. Just before he went back to work, we got a bill for $700/ month for COBRA coverage, now that we could not pay.

yep... a former friend of mine lost her job a year ago in Feb. Her COBRA payments were about half of her UI check per month. to make a long story short, never try to explain finance and taxes to someone in denial... But, having been out of work a couple times for about a year total in the last 10 years, it gets pretty scary, and part of that time was spent without health insurance either.

YOU'D HAVE FREE HEALTH CARE IF YOU WERE A CRIMINAL IN JAIL OR ON WELFARE THOUGH

yeah.. I can see free plastic surgery, quintuple bypasses and transplants among so many of our jail populations...

You really think that the quality of care, and the priority you receive in prison is incredibly-high?

Higher than they deserve I am sure!!

I don't even know where to start on this statement. Christ.

tommcat327 wrote:

son of a beach wrote:but race was indeed brought up

the "large black family" with food stamps (if they were white would that have been mentioned)
If I were black on here this would offend me, but being that that I'm white and my wife is black it is offensive anyway.

"Puerto Ricans just take our welfare"
The comment about "Idiots who vote for whoever Al Sharton, Farakahn, and Jesse Jackson", mostly black and everyone knows this.
I mean come on just say it , ya know you want to.

Some people should realize that some of the people or races they are talking about could be on here and how could these comments not be offensive when you're stereotyping or profiling?
From my unique perspective and experiences I've seen it a million times and am pretty good at reading between the lines.

SO YOU'D PREFER I MAKE SURE THERE ARE NO MINORITIES ACTUALLY ON HERE BEFORE I MAKE MY COMMENTS?I DONT REALLY CARE WHO IS HERE,MY OPINIONS ARE BASED ON WHAT I SEE ON A DAILY BASIS AND I WILL NOT REFRAIN FROM COMMENTING ON IT TO BE SURE I DONT OFFEND ANYONE.
AND WHAT DO YOU MEAN JUST SAY IT BECAUSE I WANT TO?WHAT IS IT YOU THINK I WANT TO SAY THAT I HAVENT?

no, just before you make potentially offensive comments and I'm sure there are rules on here somewhere.
One of my co-workers is Puerto Rican and a great guy and not on welfare thank you very much.
My opinions are also based on what I see on a daily basis from my insider viewpoint, especially here in redneck northern Florida.
Settle down, show some cooth, the hate will consume you.

RinglingRingling wrote:yeah.. I can see free plastic surgery, quintuple bypasses and transplants among so many of our jail populations...

You really think that the quality of care, and the priority you receive in prison is incredibly-high?

quality of the health care is not the issue,it is still free including dental,which is more than several of the people here got once they were out of work.after their taxes went to welfare and the jail systems for years while they were employed they found themselves with less than a convicted killer would recieve.
and i have heard of prisoners suing for plastic surgery.true or not i dont know but i read about it in the paper

son of a beach wrote:no, just before you make potentially offensive comments and I'm sure there are rules on here somewhere.
One of my co-workers is Puerto Rican and a great guy and not on welfare thank you very much.
My opinions are also based on what I see on a daily basis from my insider viewpoint, especially here in redneck northern Florida.
Settle down, the hate will consume you.

well maybe i find your statements offensive.and trust me,i am currently settled down

well then great.
I guess I'm just sensitive when it comes to race and generalizing given the make-up of my family and friends which is not a bad thing in my opinion.

Got kinda cobo-like in here for a minute.
Must have beer.....and dare I say, A Mexican beer

son of a beach wrote:well then great.
I guess I'm just sensitive when it comes to race and generalizing given the make-up of my family and friends which is not a bad thing in my opinion.

Got kinda cobo-like in here for a minute.
Must have beer.....and dare I say, A Mexican beer

more like oversensitive i'd say

tommcat327 wrote:

RinglingRingling wrote:yeah.. I can see free plastic surgery, quintuple bypasses and transplants among so many of our jail populations...

You really think that the quality of care, and the priority you receive in prison is incredibly-high?

quality of the health care is not the issue,it is still free including dental,which is more than several of the people here got once they were out of work.after their taxes went to welfare and the jail systems for years while they were employed they found themselves with less than a convicted killer would recieve.
and i have heard of prisoners suing for plastic surgery.true or not i dont know but i read about it in the paper

a) yes, they do receive better care than say (and pardon me while I do a WAG here) 25% of the general population whose worst crime is that they change lanes without using a signal or speed from time to time. Does that mean that they should be denied basic medical care for injuries, illness, and the like? Or does it say something about the state of the health-care industry in the country? added at 1923 EDT:One should also keep in mind that prisons have gone from punishment/rehabilitation facilities seeking to be self-sufficient (raising their own food, and selling off produce/livestock); to actual profit centers. One could make an argument that, while a captive labour force, it is just sound business practice to make sure that a commodity like cheap labour is not lost to simple illness...

b) taxes go to fund the social safety net.. at least the portion not be used for defense, graft, and insider contracts... Cutting taxes doesn't decrease the need for the safety net; nor does dismantling the protection of the net reduce the need in hard times. Personally, I would love to see the majority of SES (Senior Executive Service) policy-makers, and elected officials try to make it on the poverty line for a family of 4 for their stay in office... Let them have to use the services and programs they oversee so that they don't have the insulation from problems. Bet there would be a lot more rational streamlining to make sure the goods and services are delivered efficiently. (and please don't trot out the whole concept of privatizing government services.... bureaucracy and red tape, and inertia are the same in the private sector as they are in the public, given organizations of equal size.)

"It is better to be silent and thought a fool, then to open your mouth and prove it"

-A. Lincoln

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