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There are so many issues here.

1-Smoking is legal. I agree it may be better if limited to confined spaces or designated places, I don't want to breath second hand either.
2-Taxes: Look for taxes to increase as smoking reduces. Those little cancer sticks provide a great deal of revenue, plus some jobs.
3-Insurance: The insurance business is just that, a business. I don't see rates falling to rock bottom if smoking were completely eliminated from this country.
4-Redeeming value of smoking, what's the redeeming value of alcohol?

I think the picture I see is another attempt to legislate behavior and take away freedoms. I support smokers, non-smokers, drinkers, non-drinkers, fat people, skinny people, those who wear seatbelts, those who don't, helmet abstainers and helmet users too. Just let me live my life the way I want to live it, as long as I don't harm anyone else in the process.

Thank you, I will now step down from my soapbox.

rsgeist wrote:
Yeah, and try taking a cheeseburger and fries into Victoria's Secret .....

Why are they all vegetarians?

BadHabitsAcctnt wrote:There are so many issues here.

1-Smoking is legal. I agree it may be better if limited to confined spaces or designated places, I don't want to breath second hand either.
2-Taxes: Look for taxes to increase as smoking reduces. Those little cancer sticks provide a great deal of revenue, plus some jobs.
3-Insurance: The insurance business is just that, a business. I don't see rates falling to rock bottom if smoking were completely eliminated from this country.
4-Redeeming value of smoking, what's the redeeming value of alcohol?

I think the picture I see is another attempt to legislate behavior and take away freedoms. I support smokers, non-smokers, drinkers, non-drinkers, fat people, skinny people, those who wear seatbelts, those who don't, helmet abstainers and helmet users too. Just let me live my life the way I want to live it, as long as I don't harm anyone else in the process.

Thank you, I will now step down from my soapbox.

Nicely put.

BadHabitsAcctnt wrote:
Thank you, I will now step down from my soapbox.

Just don't drop the soap.

Nicely put BHA.

BadHabitsAcctnt wrote:

rsgeist wrote:
Yeah, and try taking a cheeseburger and fries into Victoria's Secret .....

Why are they all vegetarians?

Hmmm, maybe. (what do you mean, of COURSE that's a carrot!)

On the other hand, maybe they're just prejudiced against anyone who leaves greasy finger prints behind when they're "handling" the lingerie.

ToplessRideFL wrote:Since none of us are experts......I think it best in some situations to at some point smile and agree to have a difference of opinion.

Well, I won't go and call myself an expert, by any means, but I spend a hell of a lot of time studying healthcare delivery in my graduate program and experiencing it at my job.

BadHabitsAcctnt wrote: Just let me live my life the way I want to live it, as long as I don't harm anyone else in the process.

But that's the whole point... smokers do, in fact, indirectly harm many others in the general public... whether it be directly in the same room with secondhand smoke or to society as a whole through the escalating cost of healthcare.

Ann, Smokin' hot doesn't count

iuparrothead wrote:

BadHabitsAcctnt wrote: Just let me live my life the way I want to live it, as long as I don't harm anyone else in the process.

But that's the whole point... smokers do, in fact, indirectly harm many others in the general public... whether it be directly in the same room with secondhand smoke or to society as a whole through the escalating cost of healthcare.

Until the air outside is absolutely pristine, that argument doesn't exactly fly straight and true either..

Ban the internal combustion engine.

LIPH wrote:Ban the internal combustion engine.

or do away with the ability to get around the Clean Air Act...

Cigarettes killed my brother.

Cigarettes killed my friend HK.

Cigarettes killed my friend Mike M.

Cigarettes killed my friend Ace.

Cigarettes killed my friend Steve.

Cigarettes killed my friend Colleen.

Cigarettes are killing my friend Mikey.

People who smoke are stupid.

Sure they have a right to kill themselves but they leave behind alot of friends and family who wish they hadn't committd suicide.

iuparrothead wrote:

ToplessRideFL wrote:Since none of us are experts......I think it best in some situations to at some point smile and agree to have a difference of opinion.

Well, I won't go and call myself an expert, by any means, but I spend a hell of a lot of time studying healthcare delivery in my graduate program and experiencing it at my job.

A I do not smoke, But did we not learn the lesson the last time?
B the war on DRUGS is failing.
C. IMHO a huge reason for healthcare costs is the fact the insurance
Companys have a 90 day policy for payment.. (if you are lucky)
the Health Care providers build in cost plus for the time it takes them to collect the $

prrthd1987 wrote:Awesome! They should do that nationwide

NEVER

Second Hand Smoke has NEVER killed anyone at all.

If you do not like smoking in a certain resturant or bar, plain and simple JUST DONT GO THERE.

It is a proven fact that smokers are better tippers. They stay after the meal, light up, and are happy. They are also more likely to have a drink with the ciggerate, which inturns makes a bigger check.

I will not support any resturant that does not allow smoking at all.

First you outlaw smoking, next they are gonna make all the girls in Gentelmens Clubs wear full clothing.

I RECOMMEND anyone who is for smoking bans to check out Penn and Teller's ***** episode on Second Hand Smoke. YOU WILL LEARN THE TRUTHS.

if it's not the cigs it's the big macs.

If we're gonna ban smoking ,how about starting with chemtrails?
(in my best Fox Mulder voice)

the argument that legislatures should let busineses do what that want is off base. gov't sets closing/last call times in many states, government sets health codes for food preparation and quality of foods served, the cleanliness of restaurants. if those werent in place we all would suffer.

to use the argument that smoking doesnt harm anyone, ask that question to someone with asthma or bad allergies. should they not be able to visit a restaurant because of their health condition based on several people's right to do something voluntarily.

Where has Sam been? This would be a good topic.

doxadive wrote:the argument that legislatures should let busineses do what that want is off base. gov't sets closing/last call times in many states, government sets health codes for food preparation and quality of foods served, the cleanliness of restaurants. if those werent in place we all would suffer.

to use the argument that smoking doesnt harm anyone, ask that question to someone with asthma or bad allergies. should they not be able to visit a restaurant because of their health condition based on several people's right to do something voluntarily.

Right on.

What's funny is that the same people who complain about government overstepping their bounds on this issue are the same ones that will complain about government increasing taxes and/or spending too much on health care. What they fail to consider is that, in most states, Medicaid is the single fastest growing area of government spending. And in every state, smoking-related illness is the number one cause of preventable illness and death.

Bottom line: you simply cannot say you're serious about controlling government spending unless you're willing to get a handle on diseases caused by smoking--and that includes second-hand smoke. (And sorry, I don't consider Penn and Teller to be the authoritative subjects on the matter.)

I've always been a conservative for the specific reason that I'm a budget hawk--I don't want government taxing and spending any more than they have to. That's why it p*sses me off that my tax dollars go to subsidize someone else's bad health habits. If tax dollars are footing the bill for other peoples' health care, then the government should be doing everything it can to curtail smoking.

RinglingRingling wrote:

iuparrothead wrote:

BadHabitsAcctnt wrote: Just let me live my life the way I want to live it, as long as I don't harm anyone else in the process.

But that's the whole point... smokers do, in fact, indirectly harm many others in the general public... whether it be directly in the same room with secondhand smoke or to society as a whole through the escalating cost of healthcare.

Until the air outside is absolutely pristine, that argument doesn't exactly fly straight and true either..

How so?

Big Red Parrothead wrote:

doxadive wrote:the argument that legislatures should let busineses do what that want is off base. gov't sets closing/last call times in many states, government sets health codes for food preparation and quality of foods served, the cleanliness of restaurants. if those werent in place we all would suffer.

to use the argument that smoking doesnt harm anyone, ask that question to someone with asthma or bad allergies. should they not be able to visit a restaurant because of their health condition based on several people's right to do something voluntarily.

Right on.

What's funny is that the same people who complain about government overstepping their bounds on this issue are the same ones that will complain about government increasing taxes and/or spending too much on health care. What they fail to consider is that, in most states, Medicaid is the single fastest growing area of government spending. And in every state, smoking-related illness is the number one cause of preventable illness and death.

Bottom line: you simply cannot say you're serious about controlling government spending unless you're willing to get a handle on diseases caused by smoking--and that includes second-hand smoke. (And sorry, I don't consider Penn and Teller to be the authoritative subjects on the matter.)

I've always been a conservative for the specific reason that I'm a budget hawk--I don't want government taxing and spending any more than they have to. That's why it p*sses me off that my tax dollars go to subsidize someone else's bad health habits. If tax dollars are footing the bill for other peoples' health care, then the government should be doing everything it can to curtail smoking.

Right-freakin'-on!!! Well said!