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Without going back and reading everyone else's take on the Patriots thing...here is my take.


They cheated.

Sending in signals is part of the game. Stealing signals is part of the game...it happens all the time. If you can get away with it, good for you. But the rule book specifically states that no technology can be used. You can't record it and study it later. It is a written rule. They knew they were violating it. They got caught. They should be punished.

It's the risk you take when you decide to try this.



And by the way, the same guy was caught videotaping the Packers sideline last year during a 35-0 Patriots victory. Good for the new Commish for busting them and punishing them.

Dezdmona wrote:Just heard good news about Kevin Everett.

Everett's prognosis improving

Tuesday, Dr Cappuccino says, "We may be wittnessing a minor miracle." He said that because, today, Kevin Everett was able to voluntarily move his arms and legs, a marked improvement over yesterday. He also noted that the MRI scan taken after the surgery showed only a small amount of swelling in the cord. Those are both good signs.

They used a new technique on him minutes after the injury. The doctor ordered the EMTs to give him a cooled saline solution intravenously, that makes the body go into hypothermia, they say it can greatly lessen brain/spinal cord injuries.

SharkOnLand wrote:

Dezdmona wrote:Just heard good news about Kevin Everett.

Everett's prognosis improving

Tuesday, Dr Cappuccino says, "We may be wittnessing a minor miracle." He said that because, today, Kevin Everett was able to voluntarily move his arms and legs, a marked improvement over yesterday. He also noted that the MRI scan taken after the surgery showed only a small amount of swelling in the cord. Those are both good signs.

They used a new technique on him minutes after the injury. The doctor ordered the EMTs to give him a cooled saline solution intravenously, that makes the body go into hypothermia, they say it can greatly lessen brain/spinal cord injuries.

That is so cool! And wonderphul! My boss, who used be an EMT thought was an incredible idea.

phjrsaunt wrote:

SharkOnLand wrote:

Dezdmona wrote:Just heard good news about Kevin Everett.

Everett's prognosis improving

Tuesday, Dr Cappuccino says, "We may be wittnessing a minor miracle." He said that because, today, Kevin Everett was able to voluntarily move his arms and legs, a marked improvement over yesterday. He also noted that the MRI scan taken after the surgery showed only a small amount of swelling in the cord. Those are both good signs.

They used a new technique on him minutes after the injury. The doctor ordered the EMTs to give him a cooled saline solution intravenously, that makes the body go into hypothermia, they say it can greatly lessen brain/spinal cord injuries.

That is so cool! And wonderphul! My boss, who used be an EMT thought was an incredible idea.

I know; that is awesome! I was wondering why they didn't do that more often (because I think the technique isn't "brand new") then realized that there aren't usually a team of docs around when someone suffers a spinal cord injury.

CaptainP wrote:Without going back and reading everyone else's take on the Patriots thing...here is my take.


They cheated.

Sending in signals is part of the game. Stealing signals is part of the game...it happens all the time. If you can get away with it, good for you. But the rule book specifically states that no technology can be used. You can't record it and study it later. It is a written rule. They knew they were violating it. They got caught. They should be punished.

It's the risk you take when you decide to try this.



And by the way, the same guy was caught videotaping the Packers sideline last year during a 35-0 Patriots victory. Good for the new Commish for busting them and punishing them.

The Pat's are charged with violating the following:

Patriots under investigation for following rules, guidelines violations ...
1. Page 105 of the Game Operations manual says: "No video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game." It later says: "All video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead."

2. And, a memo from Ray Anderson, NFL head of football operations, to head coaches and GMs on Sept. 6, 2006 said: "Video taping of any type, including but not limited to taping of an opponent’s offensive or defensive signals, is prohibited on the sidelines, in the coaches’ booth, in the locker room, or at any other locations accessible to club staff members during the game."

Yup, they're guilty.

Guilty of doing what EVERY OTHER TEAM does AT HOME because they have the run of the stadium and can place cameras ANYWHERE. There was a panel on ESPN this morning (Tiki Barber and others) who said: ALL TEAMS DO IT.

The Pats are guilty of trying to do it on the road and not being sneaky enough about it. You'll notice that NO OTHER NFL COACH will speak out on this because they are all guilty to some degree. Even MANGINI, who would seem to have the most to gain here, wouldn't touch it in his news conference. He knew what Belichek was doing and who did he learn from?

All teams have assistant coaches on the sideline who's job it is to try and steal the signals. THAT IS A FACT. In the future all will be more circumspect about how they go about it.

This is not a major infraction that in any way decided the outcome of the game on Sunday. The Pats will be punished (probably lose a first day draft pick), and then everybody in the league will go back to what they've been doing all along.

This signal stealing flap may have one effect in the future. At the last meeting of the rules committee it was proposed to have a defensive player with a helmet radio to receive formation calls from the sideline, like the QB on offense. It lost by 2 votes. I expect it to pass next year.

Super trooper, your right, everyone does it, but that still doesn't make it right. It's like (not exactly, but in the same vein) as when there are two guys on the field who start to mix it up. They should both get flagged, because they are both committing penalties, but only the last one seen gets the flag. Patriots were the last one seen doing it. They draw the flag.

Maybe everyone's doing it, but aren't the Patriots the only ones who got caught? And weren't they caught as least once before? If you're going to have rules you have to enforce them. If you don't enforce them the NFL might as well fire all the referees. Every team commits penalties, don't they?

Let me rephrase that. Everyone MIGHT do it, but, yes, the patriots were the ones that were caught.

CaptainP wrote:Without going back and reading everyone else's take on the Patriots thing...here is my take.


They cheated.

Sending in signals is part of the game. Stealing signals is part of the game...it happens all the time. If you can get away with it, good for you. But the rule book specifically states that no technology can be used. You can't record it and study it later. It is a written rule. They knew they were violating it. They got caught. They should be punished.

It's the risk you take when you decide to try this.



And by the way, the same guy was caught videotaping the Packers sideline last year during a 35-0 Patriots victory. Good for the new Commish for busting them and punishing them.

I agree but here is a question . . . or two . . .

4 members of the Miami Dolphins Defensive line said that they knew every audible Tom Brady called last year because they bought a tape of Tom Brady on line . . . this tape was put on the internet by some kid who, for whatever reason, was allowed near the sideline with a small digital camera. Same thing? Different because they weren't stealing signs furing the game? Should they be fined? They admitted to it. They are guilty, right? They made Tom Brady look like a fool because of that knowledge.

Curious to see how people feel about that.

LIPH wrote:Maybe everyone's doing it, but aren't the Patriots the only ones who got caught? And weren't they caught as least once before? If you're going to have rules you have to enforce them. If you don't enforce them the NFL might as well fire all the referees. Every team commits penalties, don't they?

Read below. How many teams have come out and admitted to doing it? They are all guilty . . . they admitted to doing it! Admitted guilt.

drunkpirate66 wrote:

CaptainP wrote:Without going back and reading everyone else's take on the Patriots thing...here is my take.


They cheated.

Sending in signals is part of the game. Stealing signals is part of the game...it happens all the time. If you can get away with it, good for you. But the rule book specifically states that no technology can be used. You can't record it and study it later. It is a written rule. They knew they were violating it. They got caught. They should be punished.

It's the risk you take when you decide to try this.



And by the way, the same guy was caught videotaping the Packers sideline last year during a 35-0 Patriots victory. Good for the new Commish for busting them and punishing them.

I agree but here is a question . . . or two . . .

4 members of the Miami Dolphins Defensive line said that they knew every audible Tom Brady called last year because they bought a tape of Tom Brady on line . . . this tape was put on the internet by some kid who, for whatever reason, was allowed near the sideline with a small digital camera. Same thing? Different because they weren't stealing signs furing the game? Should they be fined? They admitted to it. They are guilty, right? They made Tom Brady look like a fool because of that knowledge.

Curious to see how people feel about that.

I'd sound like a hypocrite if I said they shouldn't get punished, but the question is this: Is buying a tape that a supposed third party filmed against the rules? It is against the rules for one team to tape another, or so is my understanding, but is it against the rules to buy a tape that was not filmed by another team?

I know it sounds like hair splitting, but I think that is what they would say in their defense.

drunkpirate66 wrote:

CaptainP wrote:Without going back and reading everyone else's take on the Patriots thing...here is my take.


They cheated.

Sending in signals is part of the game. Stealing signals is part of the game...it happens all the time. If you can get away with it, good for you. But the rule book specifically states that no technology can be used. You can't record it and study it later. It is a written rule. They knew they were violating it. They got caught. They should be punished.

It's the risk you take when you decide to try this.



And by the way, the same guy was caught videotaping the Packers sideline last year during a 35-0 Patriots victory. Good for the new Commish for busting them and punishing them.

I agree but here is a question . . . or two . . .

4 members of the Miami Dolphins Defensive line said that they knew every audible Tom Brady called last year because they bought a tape of Tom Brady on line . . . this tape was put on the internet by some kid who, for whatever reason, was allowed near the sideline with a small digital camera. Same thing? Different because they weren't stealing signs furing the game? Should they be fined? They admitted to it. They are guilty, right? They made Tom Brady look like a fool because of that knowledge.

Curious to see how people feel about that.

Buying a tape of Brady's call is legal. The question must be posed... was the kid a member of the opposing team? If he or she was... then you may have a point, if not..... I don't think there is a case.

aeroparrot wrote:

drunkpirate66 wrote:

CaptainP wrote:Without going back and reading everyone else's take on the Patriots thing...here is my take.


They cheated.

Sending in signals is part of the game. Stealing signals is part of the game...it happens all the time. If you can get away with it, good for you. But the rule book specifically states that no technology can be used. You can't record it and study it later. It is a written rule. They knew they were violating it. They got caught. They should be punished.

It's the risk you take when you decide to try this.



And by the way, the same guy was caught videotaping the Packers sideline last year during a 35-0 Patriots victory. Good for the new Commish for busting them and punishing them.

I agree but here is a question . . . or two . . .

4 members of the Miami Dolphins Defensive line said that they knew every audible Tom Brady called last year because they bought a tape of Tom Brady on line . . . this tape was put on the internet by some kid who, for whatever reason, was allowed near the sideline with a small digital camera. Same thing? Different because they weren't stealing signs furing the game? Should they be fined? They admitted to it. They are guilty, right? They made Tom Brady look like a fool because of that knowledge.

Curious to see how people feel about that.

Buying a tape of Brady's call is legal. The question must be posed... was the kid a member of the opposing team? If he or she was... then you may have a point, if not..... I don't think there is a case.

the rule is that technology cannot be used to gain unfair advantage of another team's plays . . . hmmmm? I guess there is a reason why people talk with clip boards over their mouths or why three back up QB's call plays in college so the other team does not know who is calling the real one . . . but I would say purchasing a tape with the purpose of seeing things that regular tv footage didn't show is "using technology" to gain unfair advantage.

For those who are calling for the Patriots to be penalized, myself included, then the Broncos must be stripped of every single win of the 2001 season because of what Mike Shannahan said they did. Here is the article.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/inside ... of_reilly/

aeroparrot wrote:For those who are calling for the Patriots to be penalized, myself included, then the Broncos must be stripped of every single win of the 2001 season because of what Mike Shannahan said they did. Here is the article.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/inside ... of_reilly/

Do binoculars count as technology?

popcornjack wrote:

aeroparrot wrote:For those who are calling for the Patriots to be penalized, myself included, then the Broncos must be stripped of every single win of the 2001 season because of what Mike Shannahan said they did. Here is the article.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/inside ... of_reilly/

Do binoculars count as technology?

I'd say no only because they are legal for use in the upper coaches' box. This is the reason that you will often see a staffer shielding the defensive coach giving the signals, as best he can. I would also assume they would be legal on the sidelines, although I don't know it for a fact.

Here's a revolutionary thought - let the QBs call their own plays like they did 30years ago. Let the defense call its own signals. Worked pretty good for Bart Starr, Johnny Unitas, Sam Huff, guys like that.

Fun article by DR. Z at SI.com. Front page.

I tried to copy the link but it wouldn't let me.

LIPH wrote:Here's a revolutionary thought - let the QBs call their own plays like they did 30years ago. Let the defense call its own signals. Worked pretty good for Bart Starr, Johnny Unitas, Sam Huff, guys like that.

Best thing about that is it would separate the truly talented quarterbacks from those who only do well in a certain system.