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LIPH wrote:

CaptainP wrote:Yanks deal Tyler Clippard to Nationals for Jonathan Albaladejo

I may start listening to some Yankees games on the radio just to hear the a-hole John Sterling try to pronounce Albaladejo.

drunkpirate66 wrote:Can't firgure out the Yankees . . .

they don't pony up the money for Dice K . . . they were outbid by the Red Sox. I know the pitching market is expensive, but I don't think a #2 or 3 starter is worth $100 million

Ok . . . but then they spend 40 something million on a nob like Kei Igawa . .
pure reaction move that flopped. He's a nob just like his buddy Carl Pavano. Won't argue that

. OK . . . . and then they go out and spend 25 million too much on Clemens .
At the time, they needed another pitcher because of the huge hole they were in. Fact of the matter is, as overpaid as he was (not gonna argue that), he provided stability to the rotation. I think the amount of shock there was over Clemens salary about equaled the amount of money Dice K got.

. . OK . . . then they won't put Ian Kennedy in a deal for Johan Santana but they will put Phillip Hughes in . . .
They did originally offer Kennedy and Melky Cabrera and mid-level, but the Twins wanted more. So they upped it with Hughes. Twins didn't like that deal and the Yankees backed out. Good for them. For as much as they would have had to pay Santana, I'd almost rather have a much cheaper Hughes or Kennedy.

OK . . . now it appears they lost Santana because of it . . . OK . . . so they sign an oldie Pettite who won't do much
Pettitte had a great year last year. Pitched great down the stretch and had the best start of any Yankee in the postseason.

. . . OK . . . and now it appears they lost out to Dan Haren at Arizona who is offering Conor Jackson . . . so now the Yankees are stuck with little no pitching and a horrible bull pen . . . OK.
As of now, their rotation is CM Wang who's going to win 15-20 games, Phil Hughes, who was brilliant for the Yankees in the postseason, and if he didn't get hurt probably would have made Clemens irrelevant last year. I think he wins 15-20 games also. Apparently, Joba is going to start because the Yankees are higher on him than they are on Hughes. If that's true, throw him in for 15-20 wins. Pettitte should give the Yankees 13-17 wins. Mussina probably 10-15. Add Kennedy in there probably for 10-15 wins if he starts. The problem for the Yankees isn't going to be starting pitching, I think they have plenty of that.

The problem is relief. As of now they have an aging Rivera, an inconsistent at best Farnsworth and Luis Vizcaino who wore down because Torre constantly turned to him. Both are 7th inning guys at best. I would love to see Joba go back to the pen a la Papelbon, and get eased into the closer role. Joba and Rivera would make one of the best 8th-9th inning guys in the majors and

jonesbeach10 wrote:

drunkpirate66 wrote:Can't firgure out the Yankees . . .

they don't pony up the money for Dice K . . . they were outbid by the Red Sox. I know the pitching market is expensive, but I don't think a #2 or 3 starter is worth $100 million

Ok . . . but then they spend 40 something million on a nob like Kei Igawa . .
pure reaction move that flopped. He's a nob just like his buddy Carl Pavano. Won't argue that

. OK . . . . and then they go out and spend 25 million too much on Clemens .
At the time, they needed another pitcher because of the huge hole they were in. Fact of the matter is, as overpaid as he was (not gonna argue that), he provided stability to the rotation. I think the amount of shock there was over Clemens salary about equaled the amount of money Dice K got.

. . OK . . . then they won't put Ian Kennedy in a deal for Johan Santana but they will put Phillip Hughes in . . .
They did originally offer Kennedy and Melky Cabrera and mid-level, but the Twins wanted more. So they upped it with Hughes. Twins didn't like that deal and the Yankees backed out. Good for them. For as much as they would have had to pay Santana, I'd almost rather have a much cheaper Hughes or Kennedy.

OK . . . now it appears they lost Santana because of it . . . OK . . . so they sign an oldie Pettite who won't do much
Pettitte had a great year last year. Pitched great down the stretch and had the best start of any Yankee in the postseason.

. . . OK . . . and now it appears they lost out to Dan Haren at Arizona who is offering Conor Jackson . . . so now the Yankees are stuck with little no pitching and a horrible bull pen . . . OK.
As of now, their rotation is CM Wang who's going to win 15-20 games, Phil Hughes, who was brilliant for the Yankees in the postseason, and if he didn't get hurt probably would have made Clemens irrelevant last year. I think he wins 15-20 games also. Apparently, Joba is going to start because the Yankees are higher on him than they are on Hughes. If that's true, throw him in for 15-20 wins. Pettitte should give the Yankees 13-17 wins. Mussina probably 10-15. Add Kennedy in there probably for 10-15 wins if he starts. The problem for the Yankees isn't going to be starting pitching, I think they have plenty of that.

The problem is relief. As of now they have an aging Rivera, an inconsistent at best Farnsworth and Luis Vizcaino who wore down because Torre constantly turned to him. Both are 7th inning guys at best. I would love to see Joba go back to the pen a la Papelbon, and get eased into the closer role. Joba and Rivera would make one of the best 8th-9th inning guys in the majors and

drunkpirate66 wrote:Detroit is retarded!

Trading away 6 prospects including the awesome Cameron Maybin and Andew Miller for a loser D - Train and Miguel Cabrera?

Come on Detroit!
Bad . . . bad move.

jonesbeach10 wrote: . OK . . . . and then they go out and spend 25 million too much on Clemens .
At the time, they needed another pitcher because of the huge hole they were in. Fact of the matter is, as overpaid as he was (not gonna argue that), he provided stability to the rotation. I think the amount of shock there was over Clemens salary about equaled the amount of money Dice K got.

CaptainP wrote:...once Zumaya comes back from a fluke injury (hurt while escaping the fires in San Diego)

CaptainP wrote:Don't be so quick to bash the Tigers. They want to win NOW.
They got 2 potential Superstars who are 27 and 25 years old.
They gave up a lot of future prospects, but look at their lineup and rotation. Do they really need them?

ROTATION:
Justin Verlander
Jeremy Bonderman
Dontrelle Willis
Kenny Rogers
Nate Robertson

LINEUP:
C Rodriguez
1B Guillen
2B Polanco
SS Renteria
3B Cabrera
OF Granderson, Ordonez, Jones
DH Sheffield

Nice mix of experience and youth. Very few holes left...Robertson & Jones maybe...The bullpen is solid once Zumaya comes back from a fluke injury (hurt while escaping the fires in San Diego)


They may have given up a lot, but they also can compete with anyone in the AL now.

drunkpirate66 wrote:

CaptainP wrote:Don't be so quick to bash the Tigers. They want to win NOW.
They got 2 potential Superstars who are 27 and 25 years old.
They gave up a lot of future prospects, but look at their lineup and rotation. Do they really need them?

ROTATION:
Justin Verlander
Jeremy Bonderman
Dontrelle Willis
Kenny Rogers
Nate Robertson

LINEUP:
C Rodriguez
1B Guillen
2B Polanco
SS Renteria
3B Cabrera
OF Granderson, Ordonez, Jones
DH Sheffield

Nice mix of experience and youth. Very few holes left...Robertson & Jones maybe...The bullpen is solid once Zumaya comes back from a fluke injury (hurt while escaping the fires in San Diego)


They may have given up a lot, but they also can compete with anyone in the AL now.

There should be no argument when I say: Andrew Miller is twice the pitcher of Dontrelle Willis . . . Willis got lit up in the NL . . . he is going to get slammed in the AL . . .

Miller is younger, cheaper, and most importantly better . . .

and given a year, Maybin will be a premiere outfielder . . . I argue (and I really hate fat, slow power guys) that Maybin is more valuable than Cabrera . . . now.


Overall . . . poor move for the Tigers . . . their pitching staff got worse . . . and, although they added power; it was through a fat, slow, K' machine who is a medioce defender at best.

drunkpirate66 wrote:

jonesbeach10 wrote:

drunkpirate66 wrote:Can't firgure out the Yankees . . .

they don't pony up the money for Dice K . . . they were outbid by the Red Sox. I know the pitching market is expensive, but I don't think a #2 or 3 starter is worth $100 million

Ok . . . but then they spend 40 something million on a nob like Kei Igawa . .
pure reaction move that flopped. He's a nob just like his buddy Carl Pavano. Won't argue that

. OK . . . . and then they go out and spend 25 million too much on Clemens .
At the time, they needed another pitcher because of the huge hole they were in. Fact of the matter is, as overpaid as he was (not gonna argue that), he provided stability to the rotation. I think the amount of shock there was over Clemens salary about equaled the amount of money Dice K got.

. . OK . . . then they won't put Ian Kennedy in a deal for Johan Santana but they will put Phillip Hughes in . . .
They did originally offer Kennedy and Melky Cabrera and mid-level, but the Twins wanted more. So they upped it with Hughes. Twins didn't like that deal and the Yankees backed out. Good for them. For as much as they would have had to pay Santana, I'd almost rather have a much cheaper Hughes or Kennedy.

OK . . . now it appears they lost Santana because of it . . . OK . . . so they sign an oldie Pettite who won't do much
Pettitte had a great year last year. Pitched great down the stretch and had the best start of any Yankee in the postseason.

. . . OK . . . and now it appears they lost out to Dan Haren at Arizona who is offering Conor Jackson . . . so now the Yankees are stuck with little no pitching and a horrible bull pen . . . OK.
As of now, their rotation is CM Wang who's going to win 15-20 games, Phil Hughes, who was brilliant for the Yankees in the postseason, and if he didn't get hurt probably would have made Clemens irrelevant last year. I think he wins 15-20 games also. Apparently, Joba is going to start because the Yankees are higher on him than they are on Hughes. If that's true, throw him in for 15-20 wins. Pettitte should give the Yankees 13-17 wins. Mussina probably 10-15. Add Kennedy in there probably for 10-15 wins if he starts. The problem for the Yankees isn't going to be starting pitching, I think they have plenty of that.

The problem is relief. As of now they have an aging Rivera, an inconsistent at best Farnsworth and Luis Vizcaino who wore down because Torre constantly turned to him. Both are 7th inning guys at best. I would love to see Joba go back to the pen a la Papelbon, and get eased into the closer role. Joba and Rivera would make one of the best 8th-9th inning guys in the majors and

You are entitled to your opinion, of course . . . but Ian Kennedy, Kei Igawa, and especially Mike Mussina are worth about sh it. Kennedy could be a decent 5 starter at best on the Red Sox.

I like Wang (joke . . . here) . . . and Hughes in about a year . . . Pettite might win 12 . . . but as a whole the staff for the Yankees right now is pretty darn bad.

The bottom line is simple: as it is right now there is no way that rotation can compete with the Red Sox' rotation with or without Santana . . .

CaptainP wrote:

drunkpirate66 wrote:

CaptainP wrote:Don't be so quick to bash the Tigers. They want to win NOW.
They got 2 potential Superstars who are 27 and 25 years old.
They gave up a lot of future prospects, but look at their lineup and rotation. Do they really need them?

ROTATION:
Justin Verlander
Jeremy Bonderman
Dontrelle Willis
Kenny Rogers
Nate Robertson

LINEUP:
C Rodriguez
1B Guillen
2B Polanco
SS Renteria
3B Cabrera
OF Granderson, Ordonez, Jones
DH Sheffield

Nice mix of experience and youth. Very few holes left...Robertson & Jones maybe...The bullpen is solid once Zumaya comes back from a fluke injury (hurt while escaping the fires in San Diego)


They may have given up a lot, but they also can compete with anyone in the AL now.

There should be no argument when I say: Andrew Miller is twice the pitcher of Dontrelle Willis . . . Willis got lit up in the NL . . . he is going to get slammed in the AL . . .

Miller is younger, cheaper, and most importantly better . . .

and given a year, Maybin will be a premiere outfielder . . . I argue (and I really hate fat, slow power guys) that Maybin is more valuable than Cabrera . . . now.


Overall . . . poor move for the Tigers . . . their pitching staff got worse . . . and, although they added power; it was through a fat, slow, K' machine who is a medioce defender at best.

I'll never be able to convince you any different. Not if this is your honest opinion of a career .312 hitter, who is only 25 years old and has 5 years experience already.

And your opinion of Willis is clearly based on ONE season, playing for a pathetic team. He entered 2007 with a career ERA of 3.68 and a record of 19 games above .500. One bad year has soured you. And since you seem to love the "moneyball" type of stats....look at his K to BB ratio....more than 2 to 1 over his career.

jonesbeach10 wrote:

drunkpirate66 wrote:

jonesbeach10 wrote:

drunkpirate66 wrote:Can't firgure out the Yankees . . .

they don't pony up the money for Dice K . . . they were outbid by the Red Sox. I know the pitching market is expensive, but I don't think a #2 or 3 starter is worth $100 million

Ok . . . but then they spend 40 something million on a nob like Kei Igawa . .
pure reaction move that flopped. He's a nob just like his buddy Carl Pavano. Won't argue that

. OK . . . . and then they go out and spend 25 million too much on Clemens .
At the time, they needed another pitcher because of the huge hole they were in. Fact of the matter is, as overpaid as he was (not gonna argue that), he provided stability to the rotation. I think the amount of shock there was over Clemens salary about equaled the amount of money Dice K got.

. . OK . . . then they won't put Ian Kennedy in a deal for Johan Santana but they will put Phillip Hughes in . . .
They did originally offer Kennedy and Melky Cabrera and mid-level, but the Twins wanted more. So they upped it with Hughes. Twins didn't like that deal and the Yankees backed out. Good for them. For as much as they would have had to pay Santana, I'd almost rather have a much cheaper Hughes or Kennedy.

OK . . . now it appears they lost Santana because of it . . . OK . . . so they sign an oldie Pettite who won't do much
Pettitte had a great year last year. Pitched great down the stretch and had the best start of any Yankee in the postseason.

. . . OK . . . and now it appears they lost out to Dan Haren at Arizona who is offering Conor Jackson . . . so now the Yankees are stuck with little no pitching and a horrible bull pen . . . OK.
As of now, their rotation is CM Wang who's going to win 15-20 games, Phil Hughes, who was brilliant for the Yankees in the postseason, and if he didn't get hurt probably would have made Clemens irrelevant last year. I think he wins 15-20 games also. Apparently, Joba is going to start because the Yankees are higher on him than they are on Hughes. If that's true, throw him in for 15-20 wins. Pettitte should give the Yankees 13-17 wins. Mussina probably 10-15. Add Kennedy in there probably for 10-15 wins if he starts. The problem for the Yankees isn't going to be starting pitching, I think they have plenty of that.

The problem is relief. As of now they have an aging Rivera, an inconsistent at best Farnsworth and Luis Vizcaino who wore down because Torre constantly turned to him. Both are 7th inning guys at best. I would love to see Joba go back to the pen a la Papelbon, and get eased into the closer role. Joba and Rivera would make one of the best 8th-9th inning guys in the majors and

You are entitled to your opinion, of course . . . but Ian Kennedy, Kei Igawa, and especially Mike Mussina are worth about sh it. Kennedy could be a decent 5 starter at best on the Red Sox.

I like Wang (joke . . . here) . . . and Hughes in about a year . . . Pettite might win 12 . . . but as a whole the staff for the Yankees right now is pretty darn bad.

The bottom line is simple: as it is right now there is no way that rotation can compete with the Red Sox' rotation with or without Santana . . .

Well, I don't think many would argue that the Sox have a better rotation. I don't think however, the Rays have a better rotation on paper, when I can't name two off the top of my head without looking! After looking, yeah Kazmir's nice, but are you really going to say Jaimie Shields is better than Andy Pettitte? Can you say Matt Garza is going to be better than Phil Hughes?

Either way, Cashman said he isn't done yet, and last I heard, he was looking into Eric Bedard, and still looking into the bullpen (even though it's pretty much a crapshoot these days).

drunkpirate66 wrote:

CaptainP wrote:

drunkpirate66 wrote:

CaptainP wrote:Don't be so quick to bash the Tigers. They want to win NOW.
They got 2 potential Superstars who are 27 and 25 years old.
They gave up a lot of future prospects, but look at their lineup and rotation. Do they really need them?

ROTATION:
Justin Verlander
Jeremy Bonderman
Dontrelle Willis
Kenny Rogers
Nate Robertson

LINEUP:
C Rodriguez
1B Guillen
2B Polanco
SS Renteria
3B Cabrera
OF Granderson, Ordonez, Jones
DH Sheffield

Nice mix of experience and youth. Very few holes left...Robertson & Jones maybe...The bullpen is solid once Zumaya comes back from a fluke injury (hurt while escaping the fires in San Diego)


They may have given up a lot, but they also can compete with anyone in the AL now.

There should be no argument when I say: Andrew Miller is twice the pitcher of Dontrelle Willis . . . Willis got lit up in the NL . . . he is going to get slammed in the AL . . .

Miller is younger, cheaper, and most importantly better . . .

and given a year, Maybin will be a premiere outfielder . . . I argue (and I really hate fat, slow power guys) that Maybin is more valuable than Cabrera . . . now.


Overall . . . poor move for the Tigers . . . their pitching staff got worse . . . and, although they added power; it was through a fat, slow, K' machine who is a medioce defender at best.

I'll never be able to convince you any different. Not if this is your honest opinion of a career .312 hitter, who is only 25 years old and has 5 years experience already.

And your opinion of Willis is clearly based on ONE season, playing for a pathetic team. He entered 2007 with a career ERA of 3.68 and a record of 19 games above .500. One bad year has soured you. And since you seem to love the "moneyball" type of stats....look at his K to BB ratio....more than 2 to 1 over his career.

We will wait and see on Willis - but I predict his ERA will over 5.00 . . . and his WHIP over 1.40 . . .


Regarding Cabrera . . .. I know he is good young hitter. But. as I know you know, there is more than a .312 batting average . . . and his base running skills and defense factor into my opinion on him . . . I view Maybin as a Rollins type of hitter . . . which is my kind of hitter . . .

That being said - top to bottom Detroit could lead MLB in runs next season . . . . but there staff's ERA will easily be in the bottom half.

Dr.Corona wrote:

drunkpirate66 wrote:

CaptainP wrote:

drunkpirate66 wrote:

CaptainP wrote:Don't be so quick to bash the Tigers. They want to win NOW.
They got 2 potential Superstars who are 27 and 25 years old.
They gave up a lot of future prospects, but look at their lineup and rotation. Do they really need them?

ROTATION:
Justin Verlander
Jeremy Bonderman
Dontrelle Willis
Kenny Rogers
Nate Robertson

LINEUP:
C Rodriguez
1B Guillen
2B Polanco
SS Renteria
3B Cabrera
OF Granderson, Ordonez, Jones
DH Sheffield

Nice mix of experience and youth. Very few holes left...Robertson & Jones maybe...The bullpen is solid once Zumaya comes back from a fluke injury (hurt while escaping the fires in San Diego)


They may have given up a lot, but they also can compete with anyone in the AL now.

There should be no argument when I say: Andrew Miller is twice the pitcher of Dontrelle Willis . . . Willis got lit up in the NL . . . he is going to get slammed in the AL . . .

Miller is younger, cheaper, and most importantly better . . .

and given a year, Maybin will be a premiere outfielder . . . I argue (and I really hate fat, slow power guys) that Maybin is more valuable than Cabrera . . . now.


Overall . . . poor move for the Tigers . . . their pitching staff got worse . . . and, although they added power; it was through a fat, slow, K' machine who is a medioce defender at best.

I'll never be able to convince you any different. Not if this is your honest opinion of a career .312 hitter, who is only 25 years old and has 5 years experience already.

And your opinion of Willis is clearly based on ONE season, playing for a pathetic team. He entered 2007 with a career ERA of 3.68 and a record of 19 games above .500. One bad year has soured you. And since you seem to love the "moneyball" type of stats....look at his K to BB ratio....more than 2 to 1 over his career.

We will wait and see on Willis - but I predict his ERA will over 5.00 . . . and his WHIP over 1.40 . . .


Regarding Cabrera . . .. I know he is good young hitter. But. as I know you know, there is more than a .312 batting average . . . and his base running skills and defense factor into my opinion on him . . . I view Maybin as a Rollins type of hitter . . . which is my kind of hitter . . .

That being said - top to bottom Detroit could lead MLB in runs next season . . . . but there staff's ERA will easily be in the bottom half.

Check back in the fall Pirate...........I'll think you'll be eating your words. Besides, awesome prospects are just that.....prospects! Maybin COULD be the man, but Cabrera IS the man....and he's only 24 freakin' years old! Miller COULD be a great pitcher. How many times have we heard about young GREAT pitchers that never panned out!!

Dr.Corona wrote:

drunkpirate66 wrote:

CaptainP wrote:

drunkpirate66 wrote:

CaptainP wrote:Don't be so quick to bash the Tigers. They want to win NOW.
They got 2 potential Superstars who are 27 and 25 years old.
They gave up a lot of future prospects, but look at their lineup and rotation. Do they really need them?

ROTATION:
Justin Verlander
Jeremy Bonderman
Dontrelle Willis
Kenny Rogers
Nate Robertson

LINEUP:
C Rodriguez
1B Guillen
2B Polanco
SS Renteria
3B Cabrera
OF Granderson, Ordonez, Jones
DH Sheffield

Nice mix of experience and youth. Very few holes left...Robertson & Jones maybe...The bullpen is solid once Zumaya comes back from a fluke injury (hurt while escaping the fires in San Diego)


They may have given up a lot, but they also can compete with anyone in the AL now.

There should be no argument when I say: Andrew Miller is twice the pitcher of Dontrelle Willis . . . Willis got lit up in the NL . . . he is going to get slammed in the AL . . .

Miller is younger, cheaper, and most importantly better . . .

and given a year, Maybin will be a premiere outfielder . . . I argue (and I really hate fat, slow power guys) that Maybin is more valuable than Cabrera . . . now.


Overall . . . poor move for the Tigers . . . their pitching staff got worse . . . and, although they added power; it was through a fat, slow, K' machine who is a medioce defender at best.

I'll never be able to convince you any different. Not if this is your honest opinion of a career .312 hitter, who is only 25 years old and has 5 years experience already.

And your opinion of Willis is clearly based on ONE season, playing for a pathetic team. He entered 2007 with a career ERA of 3.68 and a record of 19 games above .500. One bad year has soured you. And since you seem to love the "moneyball" type of stats....look at his K to BB ratio....more than 2 to 1 over his career.

We will wait and see on Willis - but I predict his ERA will over 5.00 . . . and his WHIP over 1.40 . . .


Regarding Cabrera . . .. I know he is good young hitter. But. as I know you know, there is more than a .312 batting average . . . and his base running skills and defense factor into my opinion on him . . . I view Maybin as a Rollins type of hitter . . . which is my kind of hitter . . .

That being said - top to bottom Detroit could lead MLB in runs next season . . . . but there staff's ERA will easily be in the bottom half.

Check back in the fall Pirate...........I'll think you'll be eating your words. Besides, awesome prospects are just that.....prospects! Maybin COULD be the man, but Cabrera IS the man....and he's only 24 freakin' years old! Miller COULD be a great pitcher. How many times have we heard about young GREAT pitchers that never panned out!!