2008 Baseball Thread

aeroparrot · Post by **aeroparrot** » October 19, 2008 6:32 am

BottleofRum wrote:Just got home...

1) Many people are comparing this Red Sox playoff run to the 2004 playoff run so I will play along........ in 2004 the Red Sox won game 6 4-2 led by an unlikely HR by Mark Bellhorn..... tonight the Red Sox won 4-2 led by an unlikely HR by Varitek.... I still don't believe what I saw with that Varitek HR....

2) In 2004 Schilling got shelled early in the series and bounced back in game 6 to pitch very well.... in 2008 Beckett early in the series got shelled and bounced back in game 6 to pitch great......
2.a) I don't care what the Red Sox say, Beckett is hurt, you don't pull your "ace" from a must win game after 78 pitches unless you are concerned about him.

3) TBS, HOW HOW HOW do you screw up that bad that you can't show the start of the game? I get things happen but the fact they had a pregame show scheduled to start at 7:30pm gave them a 40 minute lead to fix things before the first pitch at 8:10, it took until 8:30pm ti get it fixed! This is completely unacceptable! I don't care what happened in Atlanta , there has to be a backup plan.... really, the Steve Harvey Show was the best they could do in it's place, Really! Seriously! The most anticipated game of the year and this happens? This is why MLB needs to get baseball off these third rate cable stations and back onto a real TV signal! I bet he FOX TV executives were laughing and laughing about this! I want to know what happened and who was fired for this screw up!

This part I don't understand, I would not compare this year with 2004 (probably most of us here would agree). The only part that would be comparable to that year is if you look at how badly the Sox were outscored in that Red Sox gave up 31 runs in 4 games and in 2004 they gave up 26 in 3.

Touch O Parrotdise · Post by **Touch O Parrotdise** » October 19, 2008 9:23 am

thank you Rays and Sox... making this a whole lot of fun to watch..

drunkpirate66 · Post by **drunkpirate66** » October 19, 2008 11:20 am

The one stat that I don't think any body brought up and is by far the most important is 4 - FOUR! hitless innings by the Red Sox bullpen: Masterson, Okajima, and Papelbon are all small market in house guys and a throw in for Dice K when he came to town. Masterson and Paps are both players who worked their way up through the Red Sox farm system and don't even make 1.5 million if you combined their salaries. They no hit a team who is on pace to break most Major League post season records for hitting. Clutch.

(And don't tell me the guy who threw out a runner at second and hit a huge homerun last night - **** didn't have anything to do with how great those young low market pitchers are. That is the value of a true catcher.)

******11th of this catchers post season career; look that stat up for all time post season homeruns by a catcher - - - this is the website for the Hall of Homeruns, right?

SchoolGirlHeart · Post by **SchoolGirlHeart** » October 19, 2008 11:30 am

drunkpirate66 wrote:The one stat that I don't think any body brought up and is by far the most important is 4 - FOUR! hitless innings by the Red Sox bullpen: Masterson, Okajima, and Papelbon are all small market in house guys and a throw in for Dice K when he came to town. Masterson and Paps are both players who worked their way up through the Red Sox farm system and don't even make 1.5 million if you combined their salaries. They no hit a team who is on pace to break most Major League post season records for hitting. Clutch.

(And don't tell me the guy who threw out a runner at second and hit a huge homerun last night - **** didn't have anything to do with how great those young low market pitchers are. That is the value of a true catcher.)

******11th of this catchers post season career; look that stat up for all time post season homeruns by a catcher - - - this is the website for the Hall of Homeruns, right?

Amen

aeroparrot · Post by **aeroparrot** » October 19, 2008 11:35 am

drunkpirate66 wrote:The one stat that I don't think any body brought up and is by far the most important is 4 - FOUR! hitless innings by the Red Sox bullpen: Masterson, Okajima, and Papelbon are all small market in house guys and a throw in for Dice K when he came to town. Masterson and Paps are both players who worked their way up through the Red Sox farm system and don't even make 1.5 million if you combined their salaries. They no hit a team who is on pace to break most Major League post season records for hitting. Clutch.

(And don't tell me the guy who threw out a runner at second and hit a huge homerun last night - **** didn't have anything to do with how great those young low market pitchers are. That is the value of a true catcher.)

******11th of this catchers post season career; look that stat up for all time post season homeruns by a catcher - - - this is the website for the Hall of Homeruns, right?

Didn't Varitek get some sort of record last night too? I thought I saw that during the game but I may be wrong.

drunkpirate66 · Post by **drunkpirate66** » October 19, 2008 11:57 am

SchoolGirlHeart wrote:
drunkpirate66 wrote:The one stat that I don't think any body brought up and is by far the most important is 4 - FOUR! hitless innings by the Red Sox bullpen: Masterson, Okajima, and Papelbon are all small market in house guys and a throw in for Dice K when he came to town. Masterson and Paps are both players who worked their way up through the Red Sox farm system and don't even make 1.5 million if you combined their salaries. They no hit a team who is on pace to break most Major League post season records for hitting. Clutch.

(And don't tell me the guy who threw out a runner at second and hit a huge homerun last night - **** didn't have anything to do with how great those young low market pitchers are. That is the value of a true catcher.)

******11th of this catchers post season career; look that stat up for all time post season homeruns by a catcher - - - this is the website for the Hall of Homeruns, right?
Amen

It is what separates Varitek from the catchers that most fantasy baseball geeks think belong in the Hall of Fame (Homeruns). Jorge Posada and Mike Piazza are two catchers most agree will make the Hall (Piazza is a lock). They have more traditional batting stats (thus the Hall of Homeruns) but cannot develop young pitchers. Look at Posada as of late with guys like Phillip Hughs . . . he is NOT a good catcher but he will be a decent DH next year. Varitek has now played in over over 60 (SIXTY!) post season games and a huge part of the reason the Red Sox have been in so many post season games since 1998 is their ability to use a large number pitchers from their minor league system and other small market purchases. Pedro Martinez and Curt Schilling are both on record stating that there is no better catcher in their careers (and they mean CATCHER not "guy who catches but stinks at it but swings a bat well which is not his job".). 60 + post season games with 11 home runs at catcher (for all you Hall of Homerun geeks) with a record setting number of no hitters caught and an All Star Game nod for the simple fact that his peers wanted to honor a guy who knows the value of catching in the year 2008.

SuperTrooper · Post by **SuperTrooper** » October 19, 2008 1:38 pm

*BOOOONG!!!!*

Tamparella, it's almost midnight!

*BOOOONG!!!*

What a gutsy performance by Beckett. The calm, experienced veterans showing the rest how it's done.

Given the circumstances, this is probably the first of many post-season duels between these two. Tampa will probably win the next one if they don't win tonight. What they learned this series will carry them further in the future.

GO SOX!!!

aeroparrot · Post by **aeroparrot** » October 19, 2008 1:59 pm

SuperTrooper wrote:*BOOOONG!!!!*

Tamparella, it's almost midnight!

*BOOOONG!!!*

What a gutsy performance by Beckett. The calm, experienced veterans showing the rest how it's done.

Given the circumstances, this is probably the first of many post-season duels between these two. Tampa will probably win the next one if they don't win tonight. What they learned this series will carry them further in the future.

GO SOX!!!

The Rays should be contenders for a long while.

Wino you know · Post by **Wino you know** » October 19, 2008 3:03 pm

As far as I''m concerned, there doesn't HAVE to be a game 7.
It's over.
The Red Sox won!
Sorry, Rays fans-I wanted your team to win too, but look at this realistically.
They were down 7-0 with SEVEN OUTS to go in game 5-they came back and won. They won a hard fought game last night on the grit of an old war horse-Jason Varitek, and one of the best pitchers in the game who pitched well enough to win, albeit, not necessarily with his best stuff.
This is a HUGE psycological win for the Red Sox-so huge there doesn't have to be a game 7.
Just like in 2004 when they were down 3 games to none against the Yankees in the A.L.C.S.
Not only has no team prior ever come back to win four consecutive games after being down 3 games to none (not in baseball, anyway-I think it's happened a couple times in the N.H.L.), but no team has ever come back from being down 3 games to none to even TIE the damn series.
So when they beat the Yankees the next three games, that was probably THE biggest psychological win in the history of sports. A game 7 wasn't necessary-they WON after tying it up in six games.
Of course, championships aren't awarded on psychological victories-you have to PHYSICALLY win four games, but after they came back and beat the Yankees the next three games, is there ANYONE here who thought they'd lose that game 7?
Same last year against the Indians after they were down 3 games to 1.
And, sadly for the Rays fans, it'll happen this year as well.
It's more than coming from being down 3 or 4 games-it's a matter of taking advantage of the opportunites given to them. Like any GOOD team, they do exactly that. THAT'S how you win ballgames.

Now I'm going to print this off and send it to every player on the Cubs.

SchoolGirlHeart · Post by **SchoolGirlHeart** » October 19, 2008 11:41 pm

Congrats, Tampa.

Post by **SMLCHNG** » October 19, 2008 11:42 pm

Sorry Jen.. and those who are such loyal Sox fans.

Congrats to the Rays.

Wino you know · Post by **Wino you know** » October 19, 2008 11:43 pm

DUH!
I was wrong.

Nice series, Red Sox.
You never make it easy, and THAT'S what makes a good team.
Congratulations on another great year.

Lightning Bolt · Post by **Lightning Bolt** » October 19, 2008 11:43 pm

WOW

It's like the world is flipping over...
I can't believe the Rays withstood that pressure

nutmeg · Post by **nutmeg** » October 19, 2008 11:45 pm

((Jen & Red Sox fans))

Congrats Rays fans!

BottleofRum · Post by **BottleofRum** » October 20, 2008 12:03 am

The Good: we likely saw Varitek's last game in a Red Sox uniform
The Bad: any Varitek AB
The Ugly: see above

TB played well, Garza pitched great and they got clutch hits and played like they were the veteran team.

Should be a good world series.

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » October 20, 2008 12:47 am

I only have a couple of minutes, so.....

WHOO HOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » October 20, 2008 12:49 am

By the way...

Garza = LCS MVP, even over Upton and Longo. What a performance!

Price = Stud. Hell, I'll put it out there now. 2009 AL Cy Young. I really believe that. Best pitcher to come out of college since Clemens.

Wino you know · Post by **Wino you know** » October 20, 2008 12:56 am

Let's see-

Baseball has expanded by FOUR teams since 1993.
The expansion franchises are:
Colorado Rockies
Florida Marlins
Arizona Diamondbacks
Tampa Bay (Devil) Rays

All of these teams have done something in our lifetime that the Chicago Cubs HAVEN'T.
It's a toughie, but would anybody like to venture a guess as to what that may be?

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » October 20, 2008 1:05 am

And one last thought before I disappear for a few more days....
(I'm two managers short at work....doing the work of 3 these days. Open to close every day)

To all the fans who were writing the Rays off after game 5 (and I'm not referring to BNers. I refer to the idiots who call Sports Talk Radio, and to the national media)....

The past has nothing to do with this year. Everyone said, "This is what the Red Sox do. They get their backs against the wall, and then they find a way to win. Look at what they did to the Yankees in 2004!"

I ask this:

What exactly did Mark Kotsay draw out of that 2004 run?
How about Dustin Pedroia?
Jed Lowrie? Jon Papelbon? John Lester? Josh Beckett?
What memories of 2004 stirred Mike Lowell on to rally this team?
Did Coco Crisp recall his younger days in center field, when he had a Jesus beard?
Alex Cora really seemed inspired by that 2004 run.
So did Jacoby Ellsbury. And JD Drew, Sean Casey, and Jason Bay.
Remember those fabulous pitching performances in the 2004 AL Playoffs by Dice-K, Hideki Okajima, and Justin Masterson?
I won't even mention Kevin Cash, Paul Byrd, Manny Delcarmen, David Ross, and Javier Lopez. (Oops, I just did)

The point being...

2008 has nothing to do with 2004.
2 different Sox teams.
There is no "Red Sox Magic".
The current Sox have TWENTY players that were not on the team in 2004, and FIVE that were.

Again, not aimed at Jon or BOR or any other Sox fan HERE. Not even at Garry for his comments earlier on Sunday. Just in general.

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » October 20, 2008 1:06 am

Wino you know wrote:Let's see-

Baseball has expanded by FOUR teams since 1993.
The expansion franchises are:
Colorado Rockies
Florida Marlins
Arizona Diamondbacks
Tampa Bay (Devil) Rays

All of these teams have done something in our lifetime that the Chicago Cubs HAVEN'T.
It's a toughie, but would anybody like to venture a guess as to what that may be?

Not $uck?