Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

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Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by green1 »

Louisiana Congressman John Flemming has proposed the following resolution
--------------------------------------------------------
IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
Mr. FLEMING (for himself, Mr. WILSON of South Carolina, Mr. BURTON of
Indiana, Mr. BARTLETT, Mr. LINDER, Mr. GARRETT of New Jersey, Mr.
BLUNT, Mr. SCALISE, and Mr. ALEXANDER) submitted the following resolution;
which was referred to the Committee on

RESOLUTION
Expressing the sense of the House of Representatives that
Members who vote in favor of the establishment of a
public, federal government run health insurance option
are urged to forgo their right to participate in the Federal
Employees Health Benefits Program (FEHBP) and
agree to enroll under that public option.
------------------------------------------------------

Additionally there is a petition on his home page which you can sign. Last name, first and email address.

http://fleming.house.gov/index.html

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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by Skibo »

It's a start. The govt employees should just use the VA. It is the health care plan of our military, who happen to be govt employees. What better way to streamline healthcare for govt employees than to have them all on the same plan?
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by C-Dawg »

I mentioned this plan in the other Healthcare thread, and urged everyone to contact their Reps and Senators, asking them to back this legislation in Congress, and author a similar plan in the Senate.
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by green1 »

C-Dawg wrote:I mentioned this plan in the other Healthcare thread, and urged everyone to contact their Reps and Senators, asking them to back this legislation in Congress, and author a similar plan in the Senate.
Good advice, and advice that I have used. What good it will do depends on how many other people call.

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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by TropicalTroubador »

If "government-run healthcare" were so horrible, why would our representatives be using it?

Why can't we just expand the healthcare plan that Congress gets as our "public option?"
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by TwelveVoltMan »

TropicalTroubador wrote:If "government-run healthcare" were so horrible, why would our representatives be using it?

Why can't we just expand the healthcare plan that Congress gets as our "public option?"
They aren't! Congress does not have a Government run health care plan. The members of Congress and almost all Government employees participate in over 200 private health care plans the same as you or I.

The only U.S. Government run plan is Medicare which they do not use, nor would they.
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by Y-NO-9-O »

TwelveVoltMan wrote: The only U.S. Government run plan is Medicare which they do not use, nor would they.
I believe the VA is a federal goverment run health care program.

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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by big john »

Skibo wrote:It's a start. The govt employees should just use the VA. It is the health care plan of our military, who happen to be govt employees. What better way to streamline healthcare for govt employees than to have them all on the same plan?
But the VA only covers the individual veterans, not their families. I'm a federal employee and I pay
out the ass for health benefits. There's no free ride for us. :pirate:
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by TwelveVoltMan »

Y-NO-9-O wrote:
TwelveVoltMan wrote: The only U.S. Government run plan is Medicare which they do not use, nor would they.
I believe the VA is a federal goverment run health care program.
VHA is a health care assistance program. Veterans deserve much more than this.
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by SchoolGirlHeart »

They shouldn't be "urged" to forego, they should be "required" to do so. If government-run health care is so great, Congress should be REQUIRED to participate.

Both I and my son came a hair's breadth from dying because of government-run health care. That kind of system S U C K S. Just ask any veteran who has to go to the VA for care.

I pay through the nose for private care, even as a federal employee.

We do NOT want the government running our health care.... :-? :-? :-? :-?


(And for those who don't know me well, I don't give a *damn* which side of the aisle the plan comes from. I'm registered "Non-Affiliated." Always have been, probably always will be. I *despise* politicians. :evil: )
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by Elrod »

Keep the congressmen and senators out of the VA and the military hospitals unless their military service qualifies them to be treated there.

It's a shame to see a young soldier, sailor, airman or Marine wait to be examined or treated while some politician waltzes in and goes to the head of the line because of his elected office. :evil:

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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by aeroparrot »

Unfortunately, the call for Congress to follow it's laws it passes for all of us won't work anyway. There is no way they will change it, why? There is a 90% minimum re-election rate for one's one Congressional delegation. Until people are serious enough to do that, it won't change.
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by The Remittance Man »

For what it's worth, Rep. Steve Kagen, D-WI (who is also a doctor), got there first. Since being elected in 2006, he has gone without health care on the grounds that if he has access to the best coverage available, the people who elected him should have it too. Sounds good to me.
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by SchoolGirlHeart »

The Remittance Man wrote:For what it's worth, Rep. Steve Kagen, D-WI (who is also a doctor), got there first. Since being elected in 2006, he has gone without health care on the grounds that if he has access to the best coverage available, the people who elected him should have it too. Sounds good to me.
So there IS one principled person left in Congress. Amazing. Refreshing, but amazing....

Tom Coburn (R-OK), also a physician, proposes ten questions we should ask our lawmakers, no matter what political affiliation we, or they, claim. I've included his commentary on the questions.
1. Why do we need to increase spending on health care by at least $1.6 trillion and steal prosperity from our children and grandchildren when we spend nearly twice per person what other industrialized nations spend on health care?

In my view, any bill that increases spending is a failure and not serious reform. The problem is not that we don’t spend enough on health care, but that we don’t allocate resources efficiently and get value for what we pay.

2. What programs will you cut and whose taxes will you raise to pay for health-care reform?

Any politician — Republican or Democrat — who refuses to answer this question or avoids the topic by deferring to the committees of jurisdiction doesn’t deserve to be in office.

3. What earmarks or pet projects that you have sponsored will you sacrifice to help finance the cost of health-care reform?

It is immoral, in my view, to ask taxpayers to make more sacrifices while politicians practice business-as-usual pork-barrel politics.

4. Will you vote for a public option that requires taxpayer-funded abortion?

The current version of the so-called reform bill requires taxpayer-funded abortion. In the House, this fact prompted 19 pro-life Democrats to send a letter of protest to Speaker Pelosi. In the Senate, an amendment by Barbara Mikulski (D., Md.) that would require taxpayer-funded abortion passed in committee. Sen. Bob Casey (D., Pa.) objected and voted no, saying, “The way it [the Mikulski amendment] is written could be interpreted down the road to include something like abortion.” Are these Democrats also part of the right-wing scare-tactic conspiracy?

5. If the public option is so wonderful, will you lead by example and vote for a plan to enroll you and your family in the public option?

I offered an amendment in committee to force members of Congress to enroll in the public option. Nine out of eleven Democrats on the health committee who back the public option refused. If the politicians creating the public option don’t have confidence in it, neither should the American people.

6. Will you vote for a plan that will allow a board of politicians and bureaucrats to override decisions made by you and your doctor?

Both the Senate and House bills set up a government-run “comparative effectiveness” board that will make final decisions about treatment and care. In committee, I gave senators several opportunities to accept language that would forbid this board from denying care. All of my amendments were rejected, which suggests that the intent is to set up a board that will ration care, as is done in the United Kingdom.

7. If you support a “comparative effectiveness” board, what qualifies you, as a politician, to practice medicine? Have you delivered health care to a single person, much less entire classes of people you claim to represent, such as the poor, the uninsured, or children?

I’m one of two physicians in the Senate, along with John Barrasso of Wyoming. I know for a fact that very few leaders in this debate have any firsthand experience or knowledge of health care, which is disturbing.

8. How will a government-run public option perform better than other failing government programs, such as Medicare, Medicaid, and Indian Health Care?

Forty percent of doctors refuse to accept Medicaid patients because the program is broken. Access to a government program — such as the public option — does not guarantee access to health care.

9. If increasing spending on health care was the solution, why hasn’t it worked yet?

The public-option “reform” is not new at all but an extension of 1960s-era public policies that say a little more government spending and intervention is always the answer.

10. Are you more committed to doing reform right or quickly? Would you consider backing a thoughtful alternative to the public option? If so, which one?

I’ve introduced a bill along with Sen. Richard Burr (R., N.C.) and Reps. Paul Ryan (R., Wisc.) and Devin Nunes (R., Calif.) called the Patient’s Choice Act that guarantees coverage and choice for every American without raising taxes or increasing spending. In fact, our bill will save taxpayers at least $70 billion. Many other members of Congress, both Republicans and Democrats, are working on alternatives that don’t herd the American people into a government-run program.

The choice is not between the public option and nothing. The choice is between the public option and an option that can win the support of the public. The future of health care truly is up to you.
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by The Remittance Man »

SchoolGirlHeart wrote: Tom Coburn (R-OK), also a physician, proposes ten questions we should ask our lawmakers, no matter what political affiliation we, or they, claim.
"No matter what political affiliation we or they claim," and yet it has hangups on taxes and abortion but no concerns about continuing to leave over 40 million Americans uninsured, or keeping one's coverage after changing jobs, or putting cost-effectiveness ahead of effective coverage, etc. Besides, Tom Coburn may be a physician, but he's also the guy who wanted Schindler's List banned from TV because he considered the nudity too sexual, and who thinks there's an epidemic of lesbianism in Oklahoma's schools. The company you keep...
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by SchoolGirlHeart »

The Remittance Man wrote:
SchoolGirlHeart wrote: Tom Coburn (R-OK), also a physician, proposes ten questions we should ask our lawmakers, no matter what political affiliation we, or they, claim.
"No matter what political affiliation we or they claim," and yet it has hangups on taxes and abortion but no concerns about continuing to leave over 40 million Americans uninsured, or keeping one's coverage after changing jobs, or putting cost-effectiveness ahead of effective coverage, etc. Besides, Tom Coburn may be a physician, but he's also the guy who wanted Schindler's List banned from TV because he considered the nudity too sexual, and who thinks there's an epidemic of lesbianism in Oklahoma's schools. The company you keep...
Whether or not our health care system should fund abortion is a fair question. It's a *different* question than whether abortion should be legal. There are plenty of folks who don't question abortion's legality and yet don't believe taxpayer dollars should fund it.

The questions still stand on their own. I am not affiliated with any party (I despise all politicians equally, including Tom Coburn), and I want answers to those questions.

As far as I'm concerned, you can even leave off the abortion question, since that's bound to be controversial, but I want to hear the answers to the other questions. But I don't think we'll ever get answers. That would require intestinal fortitude, which is something utterly absent in most politicians.
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by The Remittance Man »

There's nothing wrong with wanting straight answers about health care reform (in fact, we should all be demanding that), but most of those particular questions do not "stand on their own". They're the very definition of loaded questions:
1. Why do we need to increase spending on health care by at least $1.6 trillion and steal prosperity from our children and grandchildren when we spend nearly twice per person what other industrialized nations spend on health care?
Note how it automatically equates health care reform with "stealing prosperity from our children and grandchildren" (and this from a senator who routinely supported Bush's disastrous budgets!). There's also the neat trick of "spending nearly twice per person...on health care" without mentioning how much of that ends up in insurance companies' coffers.
2. What programs will you cut and whose taxes will you raise to pay for health-care reform?
This one is based largely on the idea that taxes are never acceptable. Regardless, I do know how I'd answer this one: I'd cancel all Bush's tax cuts on the richest of the rich, and I'd cut corporate welfare.
3. What earmarks or pet projects that you have sponsored will you sacrifice to help finance the cost of health-care reform?
This one is a fair question - but again, Coburn has a long history of not giving a care about pork as long as there's something in it for his constitutents - or his funders.
4. Will you vote for a public option that requires taxpayer-funded abortion?
...or taxpayer funding for any other medical procedure? There's no fundamental difference.
6. Will you vote for a plan that will allow a board of politicians and bureaucrats to override decisions made by you and your doctor?
Such as the decision to have an abortion? No, I wouldn't vote for that. Good thing Obama's plan doesn't do any such thing.
7. If you support a “comparative effectiveness” board, what qualifies you, as a politician, to practice medicine? Have you delivered health care to a single person, much less entire classes of people you claim to represent, such as the poor, the uninsured, or children?
Straw man. While we’re at it, Sen. Coburn, have you stopped beating your wife?
8. How will a government-run public option perform better than other failing government programs, such as Medicare, Medicaid, and Indian Health Care?
“Failing government programs such as Medicare”. ‘Nuff said.
9. If increasing spending on health care was the solution, why hasn’t it worked yet?
Because that isn’t really what has been done, and Coburn (probably) knows it.
10. Are you more committed to doing reform right or quickly? Would you consider backing a thoughtful alternative to the public option? If so, which one?
Reform has been on and off the table since 1993, arguably far longer. “Right or quickly” is a straw man too.
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by SchoolGirlHeart »

It's too late and I'm too beat to go back after each question, but I don't see them as loaded. If I saw those questions without any reference to who drafted them I'd still want answers (again, leaving out the controversial abortion question). Just one comment (and I'm NOT defending Coburn, just commenting on the question): Spending an additional $1.6 TRILLION on *anything* IS stealing a certain amount of prosperity from our children...

Honestly, I perceive you see them as loaded because you seem disagree with Coburn's view on most anything. I despise all politicians, so I simply see them as questions...

I should know better than to even open these threads. Nothing but arguing and nothing solved... :-?

*poof*
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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by flyboy55 »

The Remittance Man wrote:There's nothing wrong with wanting straight answers about health care reform (in fact, we should all be demanding that), but most of those particular questions do not "stand on their own". They're the very definition of loaded questions:
1. Why do we need to increase spending on health care by at least $1.6 trillion and steal prosperity from our children and grandchildren when we spend nearly twice per person what other industrialized nations spend on health care?
Note how it automatically equates health care reform with "stealing prosperity from our children and grandchildren" (and this from a senator who routinely supported Bush's disastrous budgets!). There's also the neat trick of "spending nearly twice per person...on health care" without mentioning how much of that ends up in insurance companies' coffers.
2. What programs will you cut and whose taxes will you raise to pay for health-care reform?
This one is based largely on the idea that taxes are never acceptable. Regardless, I do know how I'd answer this one: I'd cancel all Bush's tax cuts on the richest of the rich, and I'd cut corporate welfare.
3. What earmarks or pet projects that you have sponsored will you sacrifice to help finance the cost of health-care reform?
This one is a fair question - but again, Coburn has a long history of not giving a care about pork as long as there's something in it for his constitutents - or his funders.
4. Will you vote for a public option that requires taxpayer-funded abortion?
...or taxpayer funding for any other medical procedure? There's no fundamental difference.
6. Will you vote for a plan that will allow a board of politicians and bureaucrats to override decisions made by you and your doctor?
Such as the decision to have an abortion? No, I wouldn't vote for that. Good thing Obama's plan doesn't do any such thing.
7. If you support a “comparative effectiveness” board, what qualifies you, as a politician, to practice medicine? Have you delivered health care to a single person, much less entire classes of people you claim to represent, such as the poor, the uninsured, or children?
Straw man. While we’re at it, Sen. Coburn, have you stopped beating your wife?
8. How will a government-run public option perform better than other failing government programs, such as Medicare, Medicaid, and Indian Health Care?
“Failing government programs such as Medicare”. ‘Nuff said.
9. If increasing spending on health care was the solution, why hasn’t it worked yet?
Because that isn’t really what has been done, and Coburn (probably) knows it.
10. Are you more committed to doing reform right or quickly? Would you consider backing a thoughtful alternative to the public option? If so, which one?
Reform has been on and off the table since 1993, arguably far longer. “Right or quickly” is a straw man too.
Well said. Rational and penetrating.

However, it won't do you any good. Nobody will listen. The political process in this country has succumbed to fear, superstition and cynicism, a state of affairs that has been enabled by our collective descent into ignorance, coupled with our collective refusal to grapple with difficult issues.

On the other hand it should be said . . .

Not all politicians are the same (an absurd thought). Not all government is bad. Not all presidents are liars and potential war criminals. But it serves the purposes of those who really hold the power in our society to have us think so, and thereby disengage ourselves from meaningful participation in the political process.

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Re: Louisiana Rep John Flemming's take on Health Care reform

Post by green1 »

flyboy55 wrote:Well said. Rational and penetrating.

However, it won't do you any good. Nobody will listen. The political process in this country has succumbed to fear, superstition and cynicism, a state of affairs that has been enabled by our collective descent into ignorance, coupled with our collective refusal to grapple with difficult issues.

On the other hand it should be said . . .

Not all politicians are the same (an absurd thought). Not all government is bad. Not all presidents are liars and potential war criminals. But it serves the purposes of those who really hold the power in our society to have us think so, and thereby disengage ourselves from meaningful participation in the political process.

Flyboy and RM. Those are questions you can ask your rep if want. If not, don't. Ask other questions. But ask them, don't let this bill be passed by politicians who won't suffer under it.

The point of this thread was to point out that the politicians are, currently, exempting themselves forever from the health care system that they intend to foist upon everyone in this country. Why shouldn't they live under the system they create?

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