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All kidding aside. I just want to say a couple of things. I wasn't insulted by Jahfins comment on my initial reply. I was a slight bit upset that he used the caps on "you". That said I want to make one thing clear. I do appreciate the items that Jahfin finds and posts here. He has posted quite a few articles that I would never have seen otherwise, that I found interesting. So please everybody, take a chill pill and let's move on.
Thank you.

prrthd1987 wrote:I havent heard of some of these bands! I kno I am only 16 but if they are the greatest of all time I would have heard of them. But here's my problem: Where are the Beach Boys? Fleetwood Mac? The Eagles? I grew up listening to these 3 bands (plus a lotta Jimmy) and they have lasted long enough to be on my list. Fins up!

And who are those Velvet People? Never heard of them!!!

I don't necessarily agree with everyone included on the list either and would of added others but just because you haven't heard of them doesn't mean they're not worthy of inclusion. The Brian Wilson-era Beach Boys (just so there's no confusion with the John Stamos "Kokomo" version) are a fine example of just one group that was overlooked. Which era of Fleetwood Mac are you referring to? The Peter Green-era Fleetwood Mac or the Buckingham-Nicks version (yes, I know they've been through far more configuartions than that but these two were by far the most popular)? The latter day version of the band is the more popular of the two and while they were very popular I personally don't think they did anything that was all that groundbreaking. That doesn't mean I don't like them, that means I think there are pioneers before them such as the Mamas and Papas that the initial soft rock "California sound" could be traced to. By the same token, I would sooner pick the Flying Burrito Brothers or the Byrds before the Eagles when it comes to being among the first to successfully merge country and rock because without those bands to forge the template, the Eagles wouldn't of existed.

The Velvet Underground was led by Lou Reed and are responsible for working outside of the boundaries set for rock n' roll at the time. They have never received a lot of airplay but I wouldn't consider that a prerequiste for inclusion on such a list. It's because of their groundbreaking music which paved the way for punk and new wave years later and the profound influence they had on other artists that they are more than worthy of inclusion on any such list. It's often been said they may not of had many fans back then but all of them later started bands. The New York Dolls, Patti Smith, the Sex Pistols, Talking Heads, U2, R.E.M., Roxy Music and Sonic Youth would be chief among them.

LIPH wrote:

Jahfin wrote:

LIPH wrote:Any list of the best bands ever that includes the Ramones can't be taken seriously.

A list without the inclusion of the pioneers of punk rock wouldn't be complete. For better or worse, punk rock is a vital part of the musical landscape, that can't be denied. If it wasn't the Ramones then it would be the Sex Pistols, Iggy Pop and the Stooges or the MC5.

My point was, if you're going to be considered one of the best bands ever you should at least be able to play your instruments.

That isn't really true, especially considering that technical skill isn't a part of punk rock and never has been. Punk rock is about raw emotion, not how proficient one may or may not be on their instruments.

ph4ever wrote:just a suggestion

want a friend.....buy a dog

ph4ever wrote:If one is discussing American music I think the Monkeys should be considered.

American music is not just rock-n-roll either.

I'm sure I'll get an argument here too

What you seem to percieve as me being argumentative isn't that at all it's just me trying to make a point. The Monkees were a pre-concieved teeny bopper band put together for the sole purpose of capitializing on the popularity of the Beatles at the time. Considering this is a list of the "10 Best Rock Bands Ever" the Monkees in no way figure into it.

ph4ever wrote:

Jahfin wrote:This is the only board I know of when I try to take part in one of the discussions, I am immediately labed "confrontational".

BTW - didn't you have the same problem over at CoBo last year???

Not at all. Over there, a group of so-called Moderators decided to gang up on me and began moving my posts to different areas of the board because they too were not fond of others who's opinions differed from their own. This was all done in effort to discourage me from posting at all. I see some of the same behavior here though. People seem to read things into my post that simply aren't there so they try to tell me how I should post. Others, apparently unable to join the conversation seem to think adding humorous asides like "I like bacon" and posting book covers is a way of derailing a discussion that they think has grown too serious. I've never seen tactics like these except on Buffett boards. I'm not sure why that is as I've never been banned from any board except the COBO one. People here seem to of made up their minds that I'm too "confrontational" when nothing could be further from the truth. I take part in discussions of this nature nearly every day in one forum or another but never has the reception been deemed so controversial as here. I'm not here to put down anybody down or to be confrontational but that seems to be everyone's perception of me which is not true at all. It seems if I don't agree with everyone then I'm some kind of troublemaker. Well, if we all agreed on everything the world wouldn't be a very exciting place. So, I offer up my own opinion on matters such at these and they are totally misconstrued here.

aquaholic wrote:

ph4ever wrote:just a suggestion

want a friend.....buy a dog

want to influence people read the book

Jahfin wrote: Over there, a group of so-called Moderators decided to gang up on me and began moving my posts to different areas of the board because they too were not fond of others who's opinions differed from their own. This was all done in effort to discourage me from posting at all. I see some of the same behavior here though.

Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get you, right?

rednekkPH wrote:

Jahfin wrote:This is the only board I know of when I try to take part in one of the discussions, I am immediately labed "confrontational".

Not to stir the s**t any more than it has been, but you must have a short memory - it wasn't very long ago that you were booted from CoBO, so this isn't the only board...

I don't have a short memory at all. What happpened over there was something approaching a gang mentality where a group of moderators, who decided I was no longer welcome because of my differing opinon started moving my posts around and/or deleting them to discourage me from posting at all. As I previously said, I've never encountered this sort of reaction anywhere other than these two Buffett boards. For such a happy go lucky bunch I've never encountered such devious behavior (I'm referring to the COBO here). I've did nothing wrong there and I'm doing nothing wrong here. Why someone expressing their own opinion is considered confrontational, I have no idea.

rednekkPH wrote:

Jahfin wrote: Over there, a group of so-called Moderators decided to gang up on me and began moving my posts to different areas of the board because they too were not fond of others who's opinions differed from their own. This was all done in effort to discourage me from posting at all. I see some of the same behavior here though.

Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get you, right?

I'm not paranoid in the least. Everytime I posted something the Moderators would go behind my back and either delete my posts or move them to another area of the board. For a folks that call themselves Jimmy Buffett fans I must say I've rarely ever encountered such an uptight group of people.

pair8head wrote:All kidding aside. I just want to say a couple of things. I wasn't insulted by Jahfins comment on my initial reply. I was a slight bit upset that he used the caps on "you". That said I want to make one thing clear. I do appreciate the items that Jahfin finds and posts here. He has posted quite a few articles that I would never have seen otherwise, that I found interesting. So please everybody, take a chill pill and let's move on.
Thank you.

Thanks. Finally, a voice of reason amongst the inanity.

Jahfin wrote:

ph4ever wrote:If one is discussing American music I think the Monkeys should be considered.

American music is not just rock-n-roll either.

I'm sure I'll get an argument here too

What you seem to percieve as me being argumentative isn't that at all it's just me trying to make a point. The Monkees were a pre-concieved teeny bopper band put together for the sole purpose of capitializing on the popularity of the Beatles at the time. Considering this is a list of the "10 Best Rock Bands Ever" the Monkees in no way figure into it.

If you will read back over your posts you will see that you in fact did bring up American music in effect broadening the discussion.

Jahfin wrote:

ph4ever wrote:

Jahfin wrote:This is the only board I know of when I try to take part in one of the discussions, I am immediately labed "confrontational".

BTW - didn't you have the same problem over at CoBo last year???

Not at all. Over there, a group of so-called Moderators decided to gang up on me and began moving my posts to different areas of the board because they too were not fond of others who's opinions differed from their own. This was all done in effort to discourage me from posting at all. I see some of the same behavior here though. People seem to read things into my post that simply aren't there so they try to tell me how I should post. Others, apparently unable to join the conversation seem to think adding humorous asides like "I like bacon" and posting book covers is a way of derailing a discussion that they think has grown too serious. I've never seen tactics like these except on Buffett boards. I'm not sure why that is as I've never been banned from any board except the COBO one. People here seem to of made up their minds that I'm too "confrontational" when nothing could be further from the truth. I take part in discussions of this nature nearly every day in one forum or another but never has the reception been deemed so controversial as here. I'm not here to put down anybody down or to be confrontational but that seems to be everyone's perception of me which is not true at all. It seems if I don't agree with everyone then I'm some kind of troublemaker. Well, if we all agreed on everything the world wouldn't be a very exciting place. So, I offer up my own opinion on matters such at these and they are totally misconstrued here.

Earlier you said you had not had any problem on any discussion board. Now you're admitting that you have been banned from CoBO. So in essence you really wern't too truthful when you first stated this is the first board that has pegged you with the label of confrontational.

And since you are so familiar with all the other Buffett boards you would realize it is the nature of the Buffett boards to go off topic on almost every topic. Insofar as the book cover it's a great tool to help one with their interpersonal skills and ment as a suggestion. I wasn't trying to be funny I was dead serious. People who post here also post on CoBO and are friends with each other. If I were you I'd watch what you say and how you talk about the CoBO people.

*Walks in*

Hey Connie! You're presence is needed in the tailgate!

*Walks out*

ph4ever wrote:

Jahfin wrote:

ph4ever wrote:If one is discussing American music I think the Monkeys should be considered.

American music is not just rock-n-roll either.

I'm sure I'll get an argument here too

What you seem to percieve as me being argumentative isn't that at all it's just me trying to make a point. The Monkees were a pre-concieved teeny bopper band put together for the sole purpose of capitializing on the popularity of the Beatles at the time. Considering this is a list of the "10 Best Rock Bands Ever" the Monkees in no way figure into it.

If you will read back over your posts you will see that you in fact did bring up American music in effect broadening the discussion.

Jahfin wrote:

ph4ever wrote:

Jahfin wrote:This is the only board I know of when I try to take part in one of the discussions, I am immediately labed "confrontational".

BTW - didn't you have the same problem over at CoBo last year???

Not at all. Over there, a group of so-called Moderators decided to gang up on me and began moving my posts to different areas of the board because they too were not fond of others who's opinions differed from their own. This was all done in effort to discourage me from posting at all. I see some of the same behavior here though. People seem to read things into my post that simply aren't there so they try to tell me how I should post. Others, apparently unable to join the conversation seem to think adding humorous asides like "I like bacon" and posting book covers is a way of derailing a discussion that they think has grown too serious. I've never seen tactics like these except on Buffett boards. I'm not sure why that is as I've never been banned from any board except the COBO one. People here seem to of made up their minds that I'm too "confrontational" when nothing could be further from the truth. I take part in discussions of this nature nearly every day in one forum or another but never has the reception been deemed so controversial as here. I'm not here to put down anybody down or to be confrontational but that seems to be everyone's perception of me which is not true at all. It seems if I don't agree with everyone then I'm some kind of troublemaker. Well, if we all agreed on everything the world wouldn't be a very exciting place. So, I offer up my own opinion on matters such at these and they are totally misconstrued here.

Earlier you said you had not had any problem on any discussion board. Now you're admitting that you have been banned from CoBO. So in essence you really wern't too truthful when you first stated this is the first board that has pegged you with the label of confrontational.

And since you are so familiar with all the other Buffett boards you would realize it is the nature of the Buffett boards to go off topic on almost every topic. Insofar as the book cover it's a great tool to help one with their interpersonal skills and ment as a suggestion. I wasn't trying to be funny I was dead serious. People who post here also post on CoBO and are friends with each other. If I were you I'd watch what you say and how you talk about the CoBO people.

I was being totally truthful. I've been accused of being confrontational here, which isn't at all what happened over there. I speak my mind on how I feel about things which is apparently frowned upon here. No where I have yelled at anyone, nowhere have I called anyone names, I've merely voiced my opinion which people people apparently don't like. I'm well aware that some people post on both boards. That doesn't enter into me being able to state my own opinion. By the way, my interpersonal skills are just fine, thanks. Maybe some of you need to open your minds to the fact that maybe not everyone agrees with you.

pair8head wrote:

Jahfin wrote:

pair8head wrote:

COMMENTARY
By Eric Olsen
MSNBC contributor

When tackling a project as audacious, slippery and fraught with diagnostic peril as “the 10 best rock bands ever,” one can either cower in anticipation of the monsoon of disagreement sure to come and load the package with every manner of weaselly equivocation, or one can swagger ahead blissfully secure in the universal righteousness of one’s judgment. Being American, I choose the latter.

That said. Dude placing the Grateful Dead as number 4 is/was a really bad idea. IMHO They do not belong on the list.

And why is that? Because YOU don't like them? Like them or not, the Grateful Dead are icons of American music. Sure they get a bad rap because of their lengthy jams but with Workingman's Dead and American Beauty they made two of the best albums of American roots music ever committed to vinyl and there's nary a noodly jam to be found. They've also been highly influential; Phish, Widespread Panic, String Cheese Incident, Moe. and dozens of others were inspired by the Dead. In addition to the music itself there's the songwriting of Robert Hunter who rivals Bob Dylan when it comes to the art of songcraft. To each their own, but no list of best bands ever would be complete without the inclusion of the Grateful Dead, they are part of the fabric of Americana.

IMHO = In My Humble Opinion.

Am I not entitled to my own opinion? Last time I checked I was.

I don't see anywhere in my reply where I said you weren't entitled to your own opinion. I'm merely making a case as to why the Grateful Dead belong on the list.

OK....somehow we have gotten wayyyyyyy off track here....

I think you've both made your points...personally...Connie...you know I love you...

and Jahfin...maybe cause I've gotten to know you, when you post I understand them.....I really dont think you directed anything to anyone in particular...but I guess I wonder how a "FUN" thread about music got way off track....

can we just let it all go, maybe it's where im at...but a place that is suppose to phun, and a stress reliever isnt suppose to turn into an arguement....I understand it's discussion...but if people dont see eye to eye...then maybe just let it go???

sorry...I've been watchin this since yesterday, and maybe Im butting in...but I had to....We're NEVER going to ALL agree

parrotsgirl wrote:We're NEVER going to ALL agree

I DISAGREE WITH THAT!!!

parrotsgirl wrote:OK....somehow we have gotten wayyyyyyy off track here....

I think you've both made your points...personally...Connie...you know I love you...

and Jahfin...maybe cause I've gotten to know you, when you post I understand them.....I really dont think you directed anything to anyone in particular...but I guess I wonder how a "FUN" thread about music got way off track....

can we just let it all go, maybe it's where im at...but a place that is suppose to phun, and a stress reliever isnt suppose to turn into an arguement....I understand it's discussion...but if people dont see eye to eye...then maybe just let it go???

sorry...I've been watchin this since yesterday, and maybe Im butting in...but I had to....We're NEVER going to ALL agree

Lisa as long as he continues to comment about my comment I'm going to reply. Period. I have just as much right to comment as anyone here

nycparrothead wrote:

parrotsgirl wrote:We're NEVER going to ALL agree

I DISAGREE WITH THAT!!!

You would.

How about "The Bay City Rollers"!!