admitting to sacrilage(sp?)

Jahfin · Post by **Jahfin** » December 6, 2004 12:35 pm

I don't think it's sacrilege to like aritsts like Big & Rich. If that's what you look for in country music by all means go for it. I just find it more than a bit disheartening that the very artists that helped shape the genre such as Merle Haggard, Loretta Lynn, and the late Johnny Cash and Waylon Jennings can't even get their records played on country radio. Personally, I find the edge of country music in the tunes of artists like Todd Snider, Ray Wylie Hubbard, Guy Clark, Steve Earle, Hank III, Tift Merritt, the Old 97s, etc., but none of those artists subscribe to the flash in the pan mentality of groups like Big & Rich who are merely the flavor of the month at the time.

a1aara · Post by **a1aara** » December 6, 2004 12:38 pm

Jahfin,

I'm going to see Todd Snider and Will Kimbrough at a couple of shows this coming weekend. Should be a good time.

RhumChum · Post by **RhumChum** » December 6, 2004 12:46 pm

OceanCityGirl wrote:I like the music, but I also like the whole spectacle of the midget, the shirtless guy, the clothes, etc. They seem to be having a good time and don't really care what you think of their music. And in the end even Holy Water without all the bells and whistles of cowboy is good.

mmmmmmmm . . . Midgets!

OceanCityGirl · Post by **OceanCityGirl** » December 6, 2004 1:19 pm

I wouldn't place Big and Rich at the top of the spectrum. And I have Johnny Cash, Loretta Lynn, Merle Haggard, et.al. in my collection. Even if it was clear that they were of that caliber I wouldn't rank them great. Great requires staying power along with talent. And I believe it also requires to some degree an ability to change with the times over the decades while remaining true to yourself. Johnny Cash is a great example of an atist who was able to do this. But I believe there is a time and place for everything. I don't think you would say that Cheeseburger shows Jimmy's depth of talent. Yet it's a part of him and his personality. I doubt every day of the week you want to eat brown rice and greens. Sometimes you would rather have, well... a cheeseburger fries and a shake. And Save a Horse is the cheeseburger of music.Perhaps somewhere in them they also have the brown rice and greens but only time will tell. When we have these arguments about true country the purists are not claiming hey I just don't like BandR. They are saying I like the real stuff and you waste your time on the fluff. And that to me is so condescending.

a1aara · Post by **a1aara** » December 6, 2004 1:25 pm

If you want to talk about adapting and changing over time, then you need to check out "Van Lear Rose" by Loretta Lynn. What a great cd. It was produced by the guy in the White Stripes and he plays on it. Some cuts have been getting play on my local "alternative" radio station.

Jahfin · Post by **Jahfin** » December 6, 2004 1:30 pm

I don't consider myself a country music purist, I just don't care for the likes of Big and Rich. If others do, fine. It's just not what trips my trigger. I like a lot of what is being called alt.country and while some of it is very rootsy some of it merges punk, folk, bluegrass and other musical styles into a potent blend that the suits in Nashville have deemed unsuitable for the airwaves. Instead, we get their idea of what they consider radical and to my ears, Big and Rich just isn't it. If you feel I've insulted your tastes, that wasn't my intention.

OceanCityGirl · Post by **OceanCityGirl** » December 6, 2004 1:39 pm

Yes i like Loretta Lynn's work with the guy from the White Stripes. First saw it believe it or not on MTV as a video. Jahfin, I"m not exactly crushed. Just a message board, not life. And insulted would be a little harsh. But I do get the feeling that when it comes to country music there is a superiority heirarchy with those who listen to the old stuff at the top of the pyramid. If there is a thread about these artists I'll reply to that, but on a lighthearted thread about BandR that's different.
And I do believe if you are in music as a business it requires more then a good voice and the ability to write a song. You need to know how to work the market, how to be successful in your chosen profession. If you are content playing small clubs and bars and being listened to by people who happen upon you that's fine too. There's nothing wrong with that. But if you want to get airplay on a larger market you need to find a way to seperate yourself from a large crowd. It is this way in any profession.

Tiki Bar · Post by **Tiki Bar** » December 6, 2004 1:43 pm

I've only heard Save a Horse and Holy Water, and think they're ok songs. What I do like about Big and Rich is the the fact they don't seem stuffy and full of themselves - they seem to truly appreciate the ride so far, and to be having FUN all the way! Their smiles speak volumes!

Jahfin · Post by **Jahfin** » December 6, 2004 1:51 pm

I don't necessarily place the older artists at the top of the hiearchy, I just feel it's a shame that the very people responsible for country music in the first place can't even get played on a format they helped create. That's the Nashville way of thinking that someone like Junior Brown may be "too" country so he doesn't recieve any airplay. Instead we get the pop fluff of artists such as Faith Hill or Shania Twain who's music seems to have very little in common with country music. That's what doesn't make any sense to me. I like plenty of newer country artists but they won't get played on country music radio they go against the grain of what is expected of them in a market that is driven more by the bottom dollar than someone's actual artistic ability. It's the same system Willie, Waylon and so many others fought back in the 70s, rather successfully I might add, it's just sad to see that not that much has changed. It's this kind of BS that kept Waylon from accepting his Lifetime Achievement Award a few years ago. I think his sentiment was something along the lines of "they can kiss my a ss". I'd say that just about sums up my feelings as well. Plenty of these artists have found a way to be successful outside the mainstream thanks to the efforts of folks like Waylon and Willie that helped pave the way for them way back when.

a1aara · Post by **a1aara** » December 6, 2004 1:54 pm

I see quite the opposite. I find that people that are into "new" country or "popular" country are very closed minded when it comes to listening to anything that's not being played on your local Clear Channel country station. Not everyone but most I come in contact with.

ph4ever · Post by **ph4ever** » December 6, 2004 3:02 pm

a1aara wrote:I see quite the opposite. I find that people that are into "new" country or "popular" country are very closed minded when it comes to listening to anything that's not being played on your local Clear Channel country station. Not everyone but most I come in contact with.

I have to respectfully disagree somewhat with you on that. I like the popular country as much as I like the old country. And not everyone listens to a Clear Channel country station. I know my favorite C&W station is not CC. What I see is that the new country is bringing a whole different group of listners into country - those that were turned off at a younger age by some of the twangy older my dog my mother and my girlfriend left me so I'm gonna get drunk and puke songs that were also prevalant in the older country songs. It's not that they are necessarily being closed minded it's that some of the older stuff is just very depressing. What country is doing reminds me of what rock did in the 70's. It's becomming more of a happy go lucky upbeat type of music because the people are simply tired of the old depressing stuff.

a1aara · Post by **a1aara** » December 6, 2004 3:14 pm

You are right. I was just thinking of my area. I think we have 3 different CC country radio stations here.

ph4ever · Post by **ph4ever** » December 6, 2004 3:17 pm

a1aara wrote:You are right. I was just thinking of my area. I think we have 3 different CC country radio stations here.

We only have one CC country that I know of but they have pretty much swept the area - we've got CC this and CC that and CC sux IMHO

a1aara · Post by **a1aara** » December 6, 2004 3:19 pm

I gotta agree on that one!

tommcat327 · Post by **tommcat327** » December 6, 2004 3:36 pm

i thought the song big and rich sang on the outlaws special was great.
i dont like the save a horse song and holy water isnt too bad.i havent heard anything else from them so i cant really say what i think of them until i hear more

DeactiveCarib · Post by **DeactiveCarib** » December 6, 2004 4:02 pm

Jahfin wrote: I just find it more than a bit disheartening that the very artists that helped shape the genre such as Merle Haggard, Loretta Lynn, and the late Johnny Cash and Waylon Jennings can't even get their records played on country radio. Personally, I find the edge of country music in the tunes of artists like Todd Snider, Ray Wylie Hubbard, Guy Clark, Steve Earle, Hank III, Tift Merritt, the Old 97s, etc., but none of those artists subscribe to the flash in the pan mentality of groups like Big & Rich who are merely the flavor of the month at the time.

Wow, i just had a deja vu

DeactiveCarib · Post by **DeactiveCarib** » December 6, 2004 4:06 pm

a1aara wrote:I see quite the opposite. I find that people that are into "new" country or "popular" country are very closed minded when it comes to listening to anything that's not being played on your local Clear Channel country station. Not everyone but most I come in contact with.

but so what . . .. . if it sounds good, it sounds good. am i wrong?

I love many "popular" country acts, but the fact of the matter is i almost NEVER listen to radio. I quit listening to radio about 2 years ago because i just get so sick of everything being overplayed. From there i found a whole new world of music unknown to ohio radio, i.e., Latin music, and now it is probably my favorite genre. I find most popular country acts through CMT more so than radio, but again, whats wrong with liking popular country? A lot of country purists act like its treason or something

OceanCityGirl · Post by **OceanCityGirl** » December 6, 2004 10:53 pm

With todays technology there should be room for everything. I would assume that it wouldn't be terribly expensive for a small station to broadcast over the internet and then to find a world wide audience of like-minded souls to help fund the enterprise and maybe even make it pay. It would be similar to the idea that ebay was able to connect large numbers of collectors of what was previously obscure objects. Think along the lines of Radio Margaritaville.

Tiki Bar · Post by **Tiki Bar** » December 6, 2004 11:05 pm

The radio is riddled with "classic rock" stations... is there such a thing as a "classic country" station, and if so, where?

Chicago's US99 is the home of John Howell who has a simulcast "country gold" show on Saturday nights (which is ironic since he's not even into country music), but is there an entire format for that anywhere?

ragtopW · Post by **ragtopW** » December 6, 2004 11:13 pm

Tiki Bar wrote:The radio is riddled with "classic rock" stations... is there such a thing as a "classic country" station, and if so, where?

Chicago's US99 is the home of John Howell who has a simulcast "country gold" show on Saturday nights (which is ironic since he's not even into country music), but is there an entire format for that anywhere?

Pimping alert!!!!!!!

Directv has one!!!