It's that time again... Hot Stove!!!

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » November 27, 2005 11:34 am

tequilatom wrote:
BottleofRum wrote: Clement to the Brewers for Overbey
Overbey i heard but for Yukes..........if I'm the Red Sox , i pursue Overbey.....i think he is a pretty good player!!

The Brewers don't really have a need for Youkalis, though. They are already loaded with corner infield prospects....more than they know what to do with. Many of them are rated higher than KY. That's why the Clement deal makes more sense.

tequilatom · Post by **tequilatom** » November 27, 2005 11:38 am

CaptainP wrote:
tequilatom wrote:
BottleofRum wrote: Clement to the Brewers for Overbey
Overbey i heard but for Yukes..........if I'm the Red Sox , i pursue Overbey.....i think he is a pretty good player!!
The Brewers don't really have a need for Youkalis, though. They are already loaded with corner infield prospects....more than they know what to do with. Many of them are rated higher than KY. That's why the Clement deal makes more sense.

True..........would you trade Clement??.........and not get another pitcher back......I wonder if the Dodgers would take Youkalis for Lowe.

MonumentBeach · Post by **MonumentBeach** » November 27, 2005 12:08 pm

I think I'd trade Clement for Overbay as the Sox should be (barring any injuries) in good shape with their starting rotation. As it stands right now, they have Schilling, Beckett, Papelbon, Wakefield, Clement, and Arroyo as candidates to start. That list also doesn't include Wells who is likely to be traded, and they still also have the option on Wade Miller as well.

I think many people determined after last year that Clement might not be made for the pressure situations in big markets like Boston. He did pretty well for the first half of the year, but really struggled when it came down the stretch in August and September, and including the playoffs. He really let the Sox down when they needed him the most in key games.

By the way...I still don't get why the Sox would be interested in bringing Lowe back. They had every opportunity to sign him after the 2004 season and Lowe even stated he wanted to remain in Boston. The front office had pretty much determined that Lowe's career was headed in a downward spiral and were also concerned about his off-the-field behavior as well.

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » November 27, 2005 1:21 pm

tequilatom wrote:
CaptainP wrote:
tequilatom wrote:
BottleofRum wrote: Clement to the Brewers for Overbey
Overbey i heard but for Yukes..........if I'm the Red Sox , i pursue Overbey.....i think he is a pretty good player!!
The Brewers don't really have a need for Youkalis, though. They are already loaded with corner infield prospects....more than they know what to do with. Many of them are rated higher than KY. That's why the Clement deal makes more sense.
True..........would you trade Clement??.........and not get another pitcher back.....

I'd make that trade, yes. Of course, I'm a Brewers fan.

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » November 27, 2005 1:26 pm

MonumentBeach wrote:I think I'd trade Clement for Overbay as the Sox should be (barring any injuries) in good shape with their starting rotation. As it stands right now, they have Schilling, Beckett, Papelbon, Wakefield, Clement, and Arroyo as candidates to start. That list also doesn't include Wells who is likely to be traded, and they still also have the option on Wade Miller as well.

Miller may be the key. With that type of injury, it is usually the SECOND year back that a good pitcher shows their true form. Look at Matt Morris. He had the surgery after 1998. It was 2000 when he came back. But it was 2001 that he won 22 games. Eric Milton, too....injury in 2002. Great year in 2004. This coming year should be Miller's make or break year.

BottleofRum · Post by **BottleofRum** » November 27, 2005 9:16 pm

CaptainP wrote:
BottleofRum wrote:
While I will give Theo Epstein credit for drafting some good players who will help the Red Sox for years to come. It should be noted that 3 of the 4 minor league players the Red Sox traded for Becket were drafted and signed by Dan Duqutte.

Epstein wasn't around long enough for his prospects to become trade-able. You won't be able to judge that for a few more years.

I heard at one point that of ALL the players drafted by Duquette in his first 5 years with Boston, only 3 EVER made it to the major leagues with any team. Nomar was one, the other two were scrubs.

Maybe his drafting improved, but early on, Duquette sucked.

Duquette was a better GM than he gets credit for. He traded Heathcliff Slocomb for Lowe and Varitek. He traded Tony Armas JR and Carl Pavano for Pedro. He signed Manny, he drafted Nomar, he traded for Mirabelli, he signed Jonny Damon. The core players from that 2004 team for the most part were Duquette players or brought in because of Duquette.

Duquette wasn't perfect (Clemens and Moyer are 2 examples ) but he was better than people think.

As far as Epstein there are several draft picks of his that are sought after right now, Papplebon, Lester, Pedoria, Hanson, DelCarman, David Murphy and Shoppach.

Both Duquette and Epstein did a decent job. I feel Epstein has been over rated and Duquette has been under rated. Not saying Epstein did a bad job but he has been just as lucky as he has been good.

BottleofRum · Post by **BottleofRum** » November 27, 2005 9:21 pm

MonumentBeach wrote:
By the way...I still don't get why the Sox would be interested in bringing Lowe back. They had every opportunity to sign him after the 2004 season and Lowe even stated he wanted to remain in Boston. The front office had pretty much determined that Lowe's career was headed in a downward spiral and were also concerned about his off-the-field behavior as well.

I am only posting what I read

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/r ... ?page=full

scroll down about 1/2 way

..."The more you think about it, the more you have to like Peter Gammons's idea of a Matt Clement-for-Derek Lowe swap. The contracts are similar, and in Lowe, you have a proven end-of-the-season pitcher who can deal with the trappings of Boston..."

MonumentBeach · Post by **MonumentBeach** » November 27, 2005 10:03 pm

BottleofRum wrote:
MonumentBeach wrote:
By the way...I still don't get why the Sox would be interested in bringing Lowe back. They had every opportunity to sign him after the 2004 season and Lowe even stated he wanted to remain in Boston. The front office had pretty much determined that Lowe's career was headed in a downward spiral and were also concerned about his off-the-field behavior as well.

I am only posting what I read

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/r ... ?page=full

scroll down about 1/2 way

..."The more you think about it, the more you have to like Peter Gammons's idea of a Matt Clement-for-Derek Lowe swap. The contracts are similar, and in Lowe, you have a proven end-of-the-season pitcher who can deal with the trappings of Boston..."

Yeah I did read that earlier too. I can't say I would oppose such a trade if it were to happen...but its just strange that ownership was totally against resigning Lowe after 2004.

I think the majority of Red Sox fans would definately support it. We all saw the reception Lowe got at the ring ceremony this year. He and Dave Roberts probably got the 2 loudest ovations. Speaking of Roberts, wouldn't it be funny if arguably the 2 biggest heroes of the 2004 postseason ended up back in Red Sox jerseys this offseason.

aeroparrot · Post by **aeroparrot** » November 29, 2005 8:40 am

WNBC has reported that Joe Torre is toying with the idea of putting A-Rod or Jeter in Centerfield. Hey Yankees fans, what do you think of this? Smart move or no?

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » November 29, 2005 12:07 pm

aeroparrot wrote:WNBC has reported that Joe Torre is toying with the idea of putting A-Rod or Jeter in Centerfield. Hey Yankees fans, what do you think of this? Smart move or no?

Either player is good enough to make the adjustment. Torre says he has not talked to either player about it though. I guess it would depend on who they get to replace them in the infield.

The Yanks, by the way, have said they are not interested in Johnny Damon.

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » November 29, 2005 12:10 pm

Esteban Loiza signs with Oakland
Tike Redman traded to Mets
BILLY WAGNER signs with METS. I can't believe nobody mentioned this!

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » November 29, 2005 12:15 pm

Rumors:

Kyle Farnsworth to Yankees
Angels pushing harder for Konerko
Furcal has narrowed to Cubs/Braves as his choices. Will decide within a week.
Javier Vazquez likely headed to Washington
Brian Giles might be headed to Toronto
Mets pursuing both Benji Molina and Ramon Hernandez
Orioles going after Paul Byrd
Paul LoDuca may be going to Arizona or back to LA.
Cubs might move Nomar to the outfield.
Piazza likely headed to the Twins.

LIPH · Post by **LIPH** » November 29, 2005 12:19 pm

CaptainP wrote:
aeroparrot wrote:WNBC has reported that Joe Torre is toying with the idea of putting A-Rod or Jeter in Centerfield. Hey Yankees fans, what do you think of this? Smart move or no?
Either player is good enough to make the adjustment. Torre says he has not talked to either player about it though. I guess it would depend on who they get to replace them in the infield.

The Yanks, by the way, have said they are not interested in Johnny Damon.

If Jeter wouldn't move to 3rd base when the Yankees traded for Rodriguez, who is a better shortstop than Jeter, I don't think he'd move to centerfield either. Rodriguez might, simply because it would look good if he did it and he's all about image and appearances.

I think the Yankees are saying they're not interested in Damon because his agent is supposed to be looking for a 7 year deal. Damon's a decent player but any team that gives him 7 years is nuts.

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » November 29, 2005 12:26 pm

LIPH wrote: I think the Yankees are saying they're not interested in Damon because his agent is supposed to be looking for a 7 year deal. Damon's a decent player but any team that gives him 7 years is nuts.

That's exactly why. They refuse to offer more than 3 years.

LIPH · Post by **LIPH** » November 29, 2005 12:33 pm

CaptainP wrote:
LIPH wrote: I think the Yankees are saying they're not interested in Damon because his agent is supposed to be looking for a 7 year deal. Damon's a decent player but any team that gives him 7 years is nuts.
That's exactly why. They refuse to offer more than 3 years.

I don't know if Damon would come to the Yankees anyway. Steinbrenner would make him cut his hair, shave and take a shower.

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » November 29, 2005 12:37 pm

LIPH wrote:
CaptainP wrote:
LIPH wrote: I think the Yankees are saying they're not interested in Damon because his agent is supposed to be looking for a 7 year deal. Damon's a decent player but any team that gives him 7 years is nuts.
That's exactly why. They refuse to offer more than 3 years.
I don't know if Damon would come to the Yankees anyway. Steinbrenner would make him cut his hair, shave and take a shower.

True....but Giambi did.

aeroparrot · Post by **aeroparrot** » November 29, 2005 4:46 pm

LIPH wrote:
CaptainP wrote:
aeroparrot wrote:WNBC has reported that Joe Torre is toying with the idea of putting A-Rod or Jeter in Centerfield. Hey Yankees fans, what do you think of this? Smart move or no?
Either player is good enough to make the adjustment. Torre says he has not talked to either player about it though. I guess it would depend on who they get to replace them in the infield.

The Yanks, by the way, have said they are not interested in Johnny Damon.
If Jeter wouldn't move to 3rd base when the Yankees traded for Rodriguez, who is a better shortstop than Jeter, I don't think he'd move to centerfield either. Rodriguez might, simply because it would look good if he did it and he's all about image and appearances.

I think the Yankees are saying they're not interested in Damon because his agent is supposed to be looking for a 7 year deal. Damon's a decent player but any team that gives him 7 years is nuts.

7 Years? Um nope. Wouldn't do it. Just the agent being an agent. In terms of moving, I would agree that A-Rod would be the one moving first.

jonesbeach10 · Post by **jonesbeach10** » November 29, 2005 4:54 pm

If A-Rod moves to CF, then who would play 3B? The hole would be bigger at 3B than CF. At least Bubba Crosby can play decent defensively.

CaptainP · Post by **CaptainP** » November 29, 2005 5:54 pm

The whole Jeter/ARod centerfield thing was overblown. Torre never said it was happening, he just answered a reporter's question, and stated that both players would be capable of playing CF, and are both team players that would do it if asked.

He also mentioned that Mariano Rivera is probably the best CF on the team, but that won't be happening either!

End of story.

MonumentBeach · Post by **MonumentBeach** » November 29, 2005 6:03 pm

Speaking of the Yankees....when are they going to make a move this offseason? They are usually a lot more active than this. I'm not even hearing their name involved in many potential trades. If they are going to make a move...they better do it soon as there isn't a ton of great talent available to begin with.

One of the few people I've heard them looking into was Giles...and now it sounds like Toronto is really pursuing him hard...and the Phillies are reportedly aggresively trying to sign Tom Gordon.