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Oil is starting to wash up on the beaches of Gulf Shores & Orange Beach. Beachgoers are being urged to stay out of Alabama coastal
waters.


photo from http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/The-Gu ... 3705045235

drill, baby, drill

...sounds pretty pathetic right now

For me, the first emotion that all of this makes me feel is sadness.

capnbobby

Please don't get me wrong, I feel for the beachgoers, property owners, fisher people, wild life...

But, as I looked at that picture I wondered how the people on that beach got there...did they drive? Did they fly? did they ride bikes on rubber tires along paved roads?

We all need to take responsbility for this situation and decide what WE are willing to give up not to see this happen again...that will take some serious soul searching and very tough decisions! I understand the fisher people's livelyhood can be affected..but wouldn';t they also be affected without the fuel for the boats?

And..LB...no, it does not make that statement look pathetic unless you mean that we, all of us, have already made the decision that we will do without the end result products of drilling, then there would be no need for the drilling. Chances of that happening?

Running for cover now....

Sorry, but I'm not taking responsibility for BP's incompetence/lack of preparedness simply because I drive a car.

MammaBear wrote:Please don't get me wrong, I feel for the beachgoers, property owners, fisher people, wild life...

But, as I looked at that picture I wondered how the people on that beach got there...did they drive? Did they fly? did they ride bikes on rubber tires along paved roads?

We all need to take responsbility for this situation and decide what WE are willing to give up not to see this happen again...that will take some serious soul searching and very tough decisions! I understand the fisher people's livelyhood can be affected..but wouldn';t they also be affected without the fuel for the boats?

And..LB...no, it does not make that statement look pathetic unless you mean that we, all of us, have already made the decision that we will do without the end result products of drilling, then there would be no need for the drilling. Chances of that happening?

Running for cover now....

I've been thinking a lot about what you said here and on the one hand you are absolutely right. We, as Americans, are addicted to oil, like a crackhead waiting on another hit. We need an intervention in a bad way. We have never been asked to sacrifice like our parents and grandparents before us. Yex, there was a gas shortage in the 1970s, but since then car manufacturers have built bigger and bigger cars, trucks, and SUVs because WE want bigger cars, trucks, and SUVs. So we do hold some responsibility for the greed and enormity of the oil companies.

BUT, and it's a big but, there were decisions made by the higher ups at BP, Haliburton, and TransOcean to proceed with this oil rig without the proper safety measures. I have heard several former workers on this rig who were worried about safety but were either ignored or shut up. Those people CHOSE to ignore what they knew to be bug safety risks in order to make more profit. I saw the other day that BP has had over 700 violations over the last few years, while Shell and Exxon have had less than 10 in the same time. That is a choice made by BP not because demand was so high, but because they wanted to make more money by cutting corners. So IMHO, while the American people do hold some responsibility for high demand for oil. Ultimately in this case BP must be held culpable. Just my two cents.

UAHparrothead wrote:

MammaBear wrote:Please don't get me wrong, I feel for the beachgoers, property owners, fisher people, wild life...

But, as I looked at that picture I wondered how the people on that beach got there...did they drive? Did they fly? did they ride bikes on rubber tires along paved roads?

We all need to take responsbility for this situation and decide what WE are willing to give up not to see this happen again...that will take some serious soul searching and very tough decisions! I understand the fisher people's livelyhood can be affected..but wouldn';t they also be affected without the fuel for the boats?

And..LB...no, it does not make that statement look pathetic unless you mean that we, all of us, have already made the decision that we will do without the end result products of drilling, then there would be no need for the drilling. Chances of that happening?

Running for cover now....

I've been thinking a lot about what you said here and on the one hand you are absolutely right. We, as Americans, are addicted to oil, like a crackhead waiting on another hit. We need an intervention in a bad way. We have never been asked to sacrifice like our parents and grandparents before us. Yex, there was a gas shortage in the 1970s, but since then car manufacturers have built bigger and bigger cars, trucks, and SUVs because WE want bigger cars, trucks, and SUVs. So we do hold some responsibility for the greed and enormity of the oil companies.

BUT, and it's a big but, there were decisions made by the higher ups at BP, Haliburton, and TransOcean to proceed with this oil rig without the proper safety measures. I have heard several former workers on this rig who were worried about safety but were either ignored or shut up. Those people CHOSE to ignore what they knew to be bug safety risks in order to make more profit. I saw the other day that BP has had over 700 violations over the last few years, while Shell and Exxon have had less than 10 in the same time. That is a choice made by BP not because demand was so high, but because they wanted to make more money by cutting corners. So IMHO, while the American people do hold some responsibility for high demand for oil. Ultimately in this case BP must be held culpable. Just my two cents.

Brad I really have to disagree with you to a certain extent in the red section. I say this because I know the difference between cars of the 50's & 60's on through the 70's as I've driven them. While I will agree that we've gotten bigger vehicles to a certain extent and that is in their size only. Cars pre late 70's were heavy, made of metal and not fiberglass and polymers or whatever they're made of now. We had BIG motors and 8 cylinders that got awful gas mileage, but that was okay because gas was so cheep at the time. When the 1973 gas crisis hit you began to see more pintos, vegas, celicas, vw's and small cars taking the place of the heavy duty muscle cars. Cars since then have been manufactured to be more fuel efficient and economical.

It's obvious that the car manufacturers have the ability to make hybrid and electric automobiles. This is not a new technology but rather one that was looked down upon by the car manufacturers for years. Also a lot of the technology for a more fuel efficient cars just was wasn't around until recently - such as batteries with high capacity.

I think the fact that the American people actually started driving what originally considered those little pansy cars vs the awesome muscle cars shows an awareness by the citizenry; if they had had better technology available the majority of Americans would have bought the most fuel efficient I believe as they were already headed in that direction. Yes you did have those that bought Hummers and other less efficient vehicles but they are not the majority.

Lightning Bolt wrote:drill, baby, drill

...sounds pretty pathetic right now

Tired of the finger pointing. This is BP's fault. No one else. Until we can get new technology to the point where it is affordable & reliable, we have to keep drilling.

Washing up on Pensacola Beach yesterday.

Gives a whole new meaning to "all those tourists covered in oil"

Lightning Bolt wrote:drill, baby, drill

...sounds pretty pathetic right now

She is now claiming that she didn't ever mean offshore and actually meant onshore. Unfortunately for her credibility, a wealth of previous public statements contradicts this new position. Also, she blames environmentalists for the mess in the Gulf. Why? Because they won't let companies drill in environmentally sensitive areas like the Arctic Nat'l Wildlife Refuge. This is called "pretzel logic".

A well-known, balding, cigar-chomping radio personality also clings to this kind of logic. He blames the Sierra Club for the oil disaster in the Gulf, because by opposing drilling in protected areas they forced companies into risky, deep water drilling. He muses that the bill for the cleanup should be paid by the Sierra Club.

One of the wonderful things about this country is freedom of speech. Any idiot can get up in public and say just about anything they want and they don't have to worry about being marched off to some gulag. But the principle behind the virtue of free speech is that the truth will prevail among competing ideas, and a free society benefits as a result. It follows that for this principle to work, people have to be careful not to believe everything every idiot says.

I know some people are tired of finger-pointing. Unfortunately, in a disaster of this size, comprehensive investigations have to be carried out, not only to establish liability for the damage, but to determine if things should be done differently in the future. In addition, if company executives are found to have put the profit motive ahead of all other considerations, including the safety of their own employees and the livelihoods of those who work in and around the Gulf, then an investigation will determine if anybody should face criminal charges.

sigh

This just makes me so sad.

I was planning to take a trip back to the Flora-Bama in early September...now I'm considering Key West or Cozumel...

that just sux

Two leaks in the Gulf. Ocean Saratoga leaking as well:

http://www.nola.com/news/gulf-oil-spill ... ll_ne.html